question on terri schiavo

[dreamgirl]

Ok, this is the lady in FL who they've taken the feeding tube out of to inevitably let her starve and dehydrate to death.

I understand that the husband has the right to make life or death decisions for his wife Terri, and I understand that the parents have no say and thats' why they have taked to court, is to get rights.

I don't understand why the husband wouldn't just divorce her and let her parents make decisions for her... especially since they feel so strongly.

I don't agree that the husband has elected to take her feeding tube out... I really think he is almost murdering her by doing so especially since she has brain activity and isn't brain dead and on a respirator.

My QUESTION IS: What is the other side? Why would you want to take her feeding tube out? Am i not seeing the other side correctly?

I know she doesn't have the ideal life in this hospital, but it's still a life and I can understand her parents wanting to keep her alive by giving her food and water.

Please help me understand.... this is totally serious not sarcastic....

[THE BOUNCER]

Originally posted by dreamgirl

My QUESTION IS: What is the other side? Why would you want to take her feeding tube out? Am i not seeing the other side correctly?

I agree with you that the husband should just let the family do what they want.

As far as the other side. I dont know about you but I sure as fuck wouldnt want to live my life like that, would you? Your sitting there in a chair, you cant do anything for yourself. What kind of life is that?

[Scrumhalf]

Originally posted by dreamgirl


I don't understand why the husband wouldn't just divorce her and let her parents make decisions for her... especially since they feel so strongly.

You seem to suggest that the husband is some third party and not her family and somehow does not feel strongly about the welfare of his wife.

Maybe he loves her very much and wants her to die in peace, especially as she indicated that she would not want to be kept alive artificially.

I would think that based on the preponderance of medical opinion on this, the husband's wish is the humane approach.

[beefcake]

He has nothing to gain or lose from her dying. He has no reason to lie about her telling him that she wouldn't want to live that way? No one would want to live that way.

[dreamgirl]

Originally posted by Scrumhalf
Maybe he loves her very much and wants her to die in peace, especially as she indicated that she would not want to be kept alive artificially.

The only reason I dispute this is that he has a gf and kids with her, he's seemed to moved on (it's been 15 years now). She also never indicated a DO NOT RESESITATE and if she did, it was never in writing. After her lack of oxygen to her brain, the hospital tried to implant something and it caused her then to be in the state she is in now. She was awarded a $1.4 million malpractice suit... this was to pay for her rehab which her husband didn't send her too. There's a lot to read about and I just did on her website.

BTW-- She only needs a feeding tube to be alive and is breathing on her own.


So what I am getting from you guys is that the other side is like Mercy Death...

this is all really depressing me thinking about this...

[Bdubb]

I want to research more into it, but I heard some coworkers say that the family offered the husband money to divorce her, as well as, the husband supposedly tried to kill her by injecting insulin at some point in time.

Keep in mind this was only heard from co-workers and the truth of it could be anything. Just food for thought.

[THE BOUNCER]

I have 1 question for you dreamgirl. If you were in her position, would you want to live or die?

[dreamgirl]

honestly, live - her brain somehow works...

I know this goes against my religion but I believe that we have 1 life and when you die, that's it... I have a hard time believing that there is a heaven or hell. So if this is my one life, I'd rather live it this way. I could see my kids grow up even if I couldn't communicate with them, I could still see them and know. -- OK, now I am getting teary eyed thinking about this... ugh

[Scrumhalf]

I don't think there is any evidence that Terry Schiavo can comprehend her environment and make sense of it. In fact, all medical indications are that she has no such ability. So you may be reaching when you say that you would like to live to see your children grow up, even if you couldn't talk to them - I don't think your brain would have the ability to process that information.

The part of her brain responsible for core functions like heartbeat and breathing is still working, but the rest of her brain related to processing sensory stimuli in a human way is kaput. That is why her condition is called a vegetative state - clearly the brain has not been given the signal to turn off the lights, so she is still alive in a technical sense but that's about it.

[bowbow]

Have you looked at her? Do you see her looking at people or just stairing into space? Nothing is getting through to her. Let her go.

[blm]

Her family offered Michael Shiavo 1 million dollars to give them gaurdianship over Terry. He declined to accept it so he could honor his wifes verbal dying wishes to him. He has nothing to gain out of this except honoring his wifes wishes. Her parents continuously claim abuse towards the husband, but they are the ones that for the third time want the tube reinserted. That just makes it worse. Nunmerous doctors and specialists have declared that there is not chance of her coming out of her "persistant vegetative state" a functional human being. She is brain dead. Period. The media shows one clip over and over where she blinks, to play on the sympathy of people, like she is coherent. The doctors have observed her for hundreds of hours over the last 15 year and they all agree that she is not coherent, but brain dead. I wish they would stop tying up the court systems with this crap and just let the woman die with some dignity.

This story has taken over the media to where it is becoming a political platform for Republicans. The same time this new dispute started, there was a 9 year old girl abducted, raped, and murdered, but it took a back seat to all of this other shit regarding Terry Shiavo.

[JUICE]

i dont know what to say, but this is sad. I wouldnt wanna see anyone going through pain in both sides. The husband as in seeing his wife just there, able to do nothing. And the poor girl just there. I wish I had the power to make her walk again and live a normal life.

[hitmansb]

Not to sound cold, but who the fuck is paying for this? It's a waste of damn money to keep a vegetable alive. If insurance is picking up the tab on hopeless cases like this, then it's costing everyone in the form of higher premiums. If the state is picking up the tab, then it's a waste of tax dollars. If someone has no chance to recover, the damn plug should be pulled, end of story.

If I was lying in a hospital bed like that, I'd want the plug pulled the very minute they knew I'd never recover.

[beefcake]

Originally posted by hitmansb
If I was lying in a hospital bed like that, I'd want the plug pulled the very minute they knew I'd never recover.

Put it in writing bro, cause apparently that's the whole problem here.

[mcalo4]

Theres been numerous times when my wife and I have been sitting around and seen someone like terri, and even watching the coverage on Terri, and said to each other " if any thing like that ever happens to me please pull the plug." I've asked friends and they said they've had the same conversation with their wives. And we talked about this years ago before this incident with terri happened.

My point is that it seems that this topic of discussion is pretty common among couples and I'm sure terri and her husband have seen some pour person living like a vegetable and turned to eachother and said "if that ever happens to me, let me go."

So maybe he's just trying to make good on his promise.

That just goes to show, put that shit in writing.

[Pumpdogg]

Originally posted by blm
Her family offered Michael Shiavo 1 million dollars to give them gaurdianship over Terry. He declined to accept it so he could honor his wifes verbal dying wishes to him. He has nothing to gain out of this except honoring his wifes wishes. Her parents continuously claim abuse towards the husband, but they are the ones that for the third time want the tube reinserted. That just makes it worse. Nunmerous doctors and specialists have declared that there is not chance of her coming out of her "persistant vegetative state" a functional human being. She is brain dead. Period. The media shows one clip over and over where she blinks, to play on the sympathy of people, like she is coherent. The doctors have observed her for hundreds of hours over the last 15 year and they all agree that she is not coherent, but brain dead. I wish they would stop tying up the court systems with this crap and just let the woman die with some dignity.

This story has taken over the media to where it is becoming a political platform for Republicans. The same time this new dispute started, there was a 9 year old girl abducted, raped, and murdered, but it took a back seat to all of this other shit regarding Terry Shiavo.

They said part of her brain has liquefied and this is what happens to people in that state. The media is getting better ratings and that is what this is about for them. Its a damn shame. We have some friends of our family that has a daughter that is progressively getting worse from brain injuries from a car wreck, they have said that part of her brain has turned to liquid and as time goes on she will become a vegetable too. I think she should be allowed to die in peace, all she is right now is a warm body to go and look at.... sad very sad

PD

PD

[Kayak Jones]

It's a decision I hope to never have to make. I know hunters, myself included, who have shown more mercy to a wounded animal than this woman is being given. Starving and especially dying of thirst is a long, sad, pitiful way to go.

[Scrumhalf]

Originally posted by blm

This story has taken over the media to where it is becoming a political platform for Republicans. The same time this new dispute started, there was a 9 year old girl abducted, raped, and murdered, but it took a back seat to all of this other shit regarding Terry Shiavo.

I wish the politicians would spend about 10% of the energy they have expended on this case on real issues like balancing the budget and working on the national debt. They are mortgaging the future of the country - if they are truly worried about our kids this would be a good place to start.

[blm]

Originally posted by Scrumhalf
They are mortgaging the future of the country - if they are truly worried about our kids this would be a good place to start.

Great point

[CiViC SpiKeS]

Yeah if i ended up like that and there was no chance of me coming out.... i say give me a year and pull the plug.. im not going to run up debt and bills and cause my family anymore grief.. ill just go.

[SloppyJo]

have u seen 'million dollar baby'? situation is almost the same.. badass movie by the way

[Primal Instinct]

Dreamgirl,

Even if Terri COULD somehow have comprehensive thoughts in her head yet not be able to interact or communicate in any way, shape or form, would it be worth another 15 or 30 years of doing nothing more than breathing? I say no. Would YOU really want to put your family through such a stressful situation for decades on end?

This issue is really about quality of life. Terri is not cognizant and cannot recover from this setback. Once part of the brain dies, it cannot be replaced or grow back. That is it, game over. There will be no recovery. She's had numerous experts give their professional opinions on this matter. Something like 23 judges ahve so far made rulings in the favor of the husband. This guy had stuck by his wife for 15 years and has spent tons of money on her trying to get some help for her. She is beyond help now. She has been like this for 15 years and she will not get better. Don't confuse this with a comatose patient who still has an intact brain. She is also not like someone who has a damaged spinal cord that could someday (stem cell research?) might be cured by reconnecting the severed electrical connections of the CNS.

The parents can't let go, although they should. She is only the physical remains of the person that they once knew. She doesn't feel pain or hunger or thirst. She is alive in only the most rudimentary sense of the word. Yes, she moves and makes sounds. That is not to be confused with human interaction though. Her parents spent over 6 hours viseotaping her in her bed. Have you actually seen her? What you see on video is the best that they could offer- the BEST. What you don't see is the other 5 hours and 50 minutes of non-responsiveness from her. What is really sad is that the family has probably convinced themselves that she is folloing the balloon or responding to their touch when in fact, the father was following HER gaze with the balloon.


As harsh as it may sound, Terri is no more human than a venus flytrap. Yes, she breathes. She moves (a little) and reacts to sound and light changes, like the plant. Yet the plant does not have any human characteristic qualities about it and neither does she anymore. She does not interact with people. Her motions are randomly generated. Her brain had filled with spinal fluid and almost all of the brain tissues are dead now except for the lower brain stem area which controls breathing and involuntary movements. Please do not acscribe to Terri personality that cannot possibly exist without consciousness and brain wave patterns.

The situation is a true shame. The worst part about all of this are the rumors and the hate campaign promoted against her husband by the family, media outlets and politicians. Since when should Tom DeLay proclaim morality anyhow? What a tragic joke this is. A person can love a spouse/former spouse (dead or alive) and still love other people. He stuck with her for 15 years through the same physical state with no progress or change in her condition. This decision to remove the feeding tube is NOT some whim of his imagination. Get real, people.

People have needs to meet (mostly companionship) after much less than 15 years. He can love Terri (who he'll never get back again) and still love another woman. Who are WE to make moral judgements on him? We haven't been through what he's been through. The parents will say and do anything to keep Terri alive. Even make up stories about how she spoke, "I want to live." Sad. The mother actually said on TV, "Terri is my life and reason for my existence." We must honestly ask ourselves this one pertinent question; Is it for Terri's sake to keep her alive or perhaps could it be for their own selfish needs? They need to let her go now but it is beyond their abilities at this point.

[urso8up]

I know that if i were in taht state hat she is in and i couldn't do anything and had a feeding tube i wouldn't want to live. you can't do anything but just sit there and collect debt for you family memebers. It is no way to live i say.