Presidential Candidates

[NewbieChris]

Originally Posted by Scrumhalf

Bush started off ok after 9/11, focusing on Afghanistan. But soon thereafter, he lost his way. Maybe he took bad advice from the neocons he filled his adminstration with. Maybe he had some personal agenda to "finish what daddy didn't."

Whatever the reason, he decided to broaden his scope to include a remaking of the entire Middle East, a breathtakingly crazy enterprise. Just look at the people who have tried and failed. Both France and England with infinitely more colonial experience than we do have attempted and failed. I am not sure what hubris prompted Bush to think he could succeed.

Just think, how many troops do we have in Iraq? 150,000? If we had not decided to take on the Iraq project had put just half of that number of troops in Afghanistan, I bet we could have dropped a grenade or two into every cave out on the Afghan/Pakistan border and found Bin Laden and his cohorts. That's what we could have done had we not had Bush's misguided policies directing us.

The fault ultimately rests with Bush himself. His cabinet, his advisors, all are full of one-dimensional thinkers. He chose to not surround himself with a plurality of viewpoints and ideas so that there would be vigorous debate before any such action as Iraq would have been taken. By ruling out dissent in this manner, he managed to silence all voices except the ones singing the song he wanted to hear. And our country has to now live with the results.

History will judge Bush very harshly, in the same vein as James Buchanan whose vacillation in the face of Southern dissension led to the Civil War. Buchanan's failure to deal with the secession is generally considered to be the worst presidential mistake ever made. I will posit that Bush's ill-advised Iraq strategy will not be too far behind.

Extremely well put. One of the best summations of the Bush Presidencies I have seen on the internet in a long time.

Whatever the reason, he decided to broaden his scope to include a remaking of the entire Middle East, a breathtakingly crazy enterprise.

This is the most significant mistake that the Bush Administration made. Its completely ridiculous to believe that you can enforce a certain type of political system upon anyone, let alone the middle east. I can't even add anything because I think you are so correct.

[NewbieChris]

Originally Posted by grnmchn

He's got some support but not enough to propel himto the front of the race. He'll finish 3rd, at best, for his party.

If he brings out college aged voters you are going to be surprised. The question at hand is can he get us off our asses and into the polling booths in the VERY near future...I hope so.

[grnmchn]

Scrumhalf, you seem like a very intelligent guy, and your view points are well received. Hopefully, our next leader can figure out a way to bring the US back to it's position as world leader...

[NewbieChris]

Originally Posted by grnmchn

I'm not so sure. American were juiced up with fear/anger/hatred after that day. Had he sat back and not made immediate efforts for justice, the american public would have crucified him for that. Let's not forget that in the 6 months after 9/11 both republicans and democrats alike were looking to the government for answers. Everyone wanted immediate action. Now it's convenient for everyone to point fingers. I think he was right for going over there, but he should have had an exit strategy or a limit to how long we were going to be there. Once we were there for a year, we passed the point of no return. He was screwed either way. I just think the whole situation would be a career killer for anyone in office during an event like that.

Plain and simple the man wanted in Iraq and was using any excuse to make it happen. I don't know if he believes that the middle east really needs democracy or what, but the idea that he could change an entire region is crazy. Look at the Russians, they got fucked up doing exactly what we are doing now.

[Scrumhalf]

Originally Posted by grnmchn

Those are 4 really great points. I just don't see either a republican or democrat caring about every one of those. Some of those points are more suited towards seperate parties. But we all know, you will never find a present who emphasises every issue...

Since the quote function will not copy my earlier post, here my are my points again:

1. Fix the budget deficit and address the national debt.
2. Comprehensive health care for all Americans.
3. Develop a sound energy policy for the country
4. Get past the rhetoric and really address the immigration problem.

The funny thing is : NONE of these issues is a Republican/Democrat issue. We are not talking about abortion, or gay rights, or death penalty or any such thing which tend to split along partisan lines. The 4 items I mention above are non-partisan issues. They NEED to be addressed. They need a President that is willing to transcend the partisan rhetoric and address them. And I think that as Americans, we ought to be mad as hell that there is nobody in either the Congress or the White House who can seem to be able to even approach these issues in a rational manner, leave alone fix them.

[babyblues]

Originally Posted by Scrumhalf

Since the quote function will not copy my earlier post, here my are my points again:

1. Fix the budget deficit and address the national debt.
2. Comprehensive health care for all Americans.
3. Develop a sound energy policy for the country
4. Get past the rhetoric and really address the immigration problem.

The funny thing is : NONE of these issues is a Republican/Democrat issue. We are not talking about abortion, or gay rights, or death penalty or any such thing which tend to split along partisan lines. The 4 items I mention above are non-partisan issues. They NEED to be addressed. They need a President that is willing to transcend the partisan rhetoric and address them. And I think that as Americans, we ought to be mad as hell that there is nobody in either the Congress or the White House who can seem to be able to even approach these issues in a rational manner, leave alone fix them.

Now, that I can agree with. It seems that no one is willing to stop party bashing and roll up their sleeves to do some real work. Even the people who take a stand about abortion or gay rights or the death penalty only do so to attract votes. I don't think they're willing to address any of the issues you listed because they stand to profit from things the way they are. Our government has become corrupted to the point where they're not going to do anything that doesn't benefit them directly. Government spending actually stimulates the economy (or so they claim), the health care industry is too profitable as it is, don't even get me started on the oil industry and illegal immigrants play an important role in our economy by providing cheap labor without the cost of benefits. In order to start addressing some of these issues, we as citizens must be willing to bear with the process of change. I honestly don't think we're ready to do that.

[Turbo3000]

Government health care=terrible......

The less power the government has the better, seems people want to let the government control everything..