BF% 4.0, so I have some concerns and need insight

[3quin0x]

Im new to this forum but have been working out for years and have some questions. Let me give some stats first:

Height: 5'10
Weight: 155 (morning)
BF%: 4 (using the palm tanita, and I had to put the height to 5'8 just to get the 4.0 otherwise it shows up as E4)
I eat constantly having 8 to 10 meals a day, and 3 to 4 protein shakes a day. (day being 24 hours not just when Im awake)

I saw a nutritionist the other day and he said my metabolism was the highest he's ever seen before. My strength is above par IMO, and I feel great. My concern is my bf% being as low as it is. A friend of mine who is a nutritionist and in studies I have read say it's risky to be at that level (at a constant I mean.) Im not into competitive BB, and my bf% has for the most part always been around the same. What are some things I can do to raise it to a healthy level? What are some of the negatives that come with such a low bf% other than me getting cold or overheating super easy? Should I be doing something different with my diet maybe? I stick to chicken, seafood, def. watch my fat intake but only when it comes to trans and saturated, not completely staying away because I know the importance of fat, my carb intake is high, eating mostly complex but sticking to simple before workouts or any heightened activity. I eat about 200 to 225 grams of protein a day, about triple that in carbs and roughy about 150 grams of fat. I stay active throughout the day.

[THE BOUNCER]

Originally Posted by 3quin0x

Im new to this forum but have been working out for years and have some questions. Let me give some stats first:

Height: 5'10
Weight: 155 (morning)
BF%: 4 (using the palm tanita, and I had to put the height to 5'8 just to get the 4.0 otherwise it shows up as E4)
I eat constantly having 8 to 10 meals a day, and 3 to 4 protein shakes a day. (day being 24 hours not just when Im awake)

I saw a nutritionist the other day and he said my metabolism was the highest he's ever seen before. My strength is above par IMO, and I feel great. My concern is my bf% being as low as it is. A friend of mine who is a nutritionist and in studies I have read say it's risky to be at that level (at a constant I mean.) Im not into competitive BB, and my bf% has for the most part always been around the same. What are some things I can do to raise it to a healthy level? What are some of the negatives that come with such a low bf% other than me getting cold or overheating super easy? Should I be doing something different with my diet maybe? I stick to chicken, seafood, def. watch my fat intake but only when it comes to trans and saturated, not completely staying away because I know the importance of fat, my carb intake is high, eating mostly complex but sticking to simple before workouts or any heightened activity. I eat about 200 to 225 grams of protein a day, about triple that in carbs and roughy about 150 grams of fat. I stay active throughout the day.

Sounds to me like you are simply burning more calories then you are eating. Post your diet in the format of: Meal 1, Meal 2 etc.. and we can help you out some more. 4% is very lean but you are still in a pretty healthy range.

[3quin0x]

meal1: protein shake mixed with carb hits 4:30am
meal2: breakfast - 1 chicken breast with 2 to 3 cups of steamed brown rice
meal3: (before lunch) Ahi tuna (roughly 31 grams of protein w/ brown rice)
meal4: Protein shake (before workout)
meal5: ABB XXL drink (after workout)
meal6: Scallops or shrimp with whole wheat noodles
meal7: oolong sea bass with 2 to 3 cups of steamed brown rice
meal8: beef strips with broccoli and more rice
meal9: usually more tuna or fish
meal 10: protein shake (before sleep)

of course this is subject to changes but gives you a rough structure of my caloric intake. Throughout the day I drink chicken broth or hot and sour soup to keep the hunger at bay and with almost ever meal it's either spicy or Im putting something spicy in it, could that be a catalyst? I am CONSTANTLY hungry though. And that 4% was shown as me being 5'8 cause we couldnt get a reading otherwise. The XXL shake is roughly 1000 calories, as are my protein shakes which Im mixing with (DAYTIME) 3 scoops of ABS Whey and 2 scoops of carb hits and before bed and at 4:30am the shakes are mixed with 2 scoops of micell edge and 1 scoops of ABS with 2 scoops of carb hits

I forgot to mention with every meal and shake I mix one scoop of glutamine. Could my eating habits throughout my life have impacted my metabolism in such a way that its naturally high maybe? (I mean as far as it being "trained" to be this way) I ask because Ive always eaten healthy sticking to these types of foods and a trainer the other day actually told me to lay off eating so much, all though Im not sure how much he knew what he was saying. My father and brothers metabolism slowed at 26 but they never worked out and aren't nearly as active as I am, point being, I'm 28 and there are no signs of slowing down. Another worry again is that I'm always hungry, even after eating sometimes. I don't eat till I'm full (unless im about to hit the sack) most of the time just eating until Im content, more than snacking, less than getting to the point of feeling bloated and full. Im just trying to get about 20 more pounds stuck to me. Hope this helps, and thanks in advance for any insight you cats might have

[THE BOUNCER]

Originally Posted by 3quin0x

meal1: protein shake mixed with carb hits 4:30am
meal2: breakfast - 1 chicken breast with 2 to 3 cups of steamed brown rice
meal3: (before lunch) Ahi tuna (roughly 31 grams of protein w/ brown rice)
meal4: Protein shake (before workout)
meal5: ABB XXL drink (after workout)
meal6: Scallops or shrimp with whole wheat noodles
meal7: oolong sea bass with 2 to 3 cups of steamed brown rice
meal8: beef strips with broccoli and more rice
meal9: usually more tuna or fish
meal 10: protein shake (before sleep)

of course this is subject to changes but gives you a rough structure of my caloric intake. Throughout the day I drink chicken broth or hot and sour soup to keep the hunger at bay and with almost ever meal it's either spicy or Im putting something spicy in it, could that be a catalyst? I am CONSTANTLY hungry though. And that 4% was shown as me being 5'8 cause we couldnt get a reading otherwise. The XXL shake is roughly 1000 calories, as are my protein shakes which Im mixing with (DAYTIME) 3 scoops of ABS Whey and 2 scoops of carb hits and before bed and at 4:30am the shakes are mixed with 2 scoops of micell edge and 1 scoops of ABS with 2 scoops of carb hits

I forgot to mention with every meal and shake I mix one scoop of glutamine. Could my eating habits throughout my life have impacted my metabolism in such a way that its naturally high maybe? (I mean as far as it being "trained" to be this way) I ask because Ive always eaten healthy sticking to these types of foods and a trainer the other day actually told me to lay off eating so much, all though Im not sure how much he knew what he was saying. My father and brothers metabolism slowed at 26 but they never worked out and aren't nearly as active as I am, point being, I'm 28 and there are no signs of slowing down. Another worry again is that I'm always hungry, even after eating sometimes. I don't eat till I'm full (unless im about to hit the sack) most of the time just eating until Im content, more than snacking, less than getting to the point of feeling bloated and full. Im just trying to get about 20 more pounds stuck to me. Hope this helps, and thanks in advance for any insight you cats might have

add in some natural peanut butter to a few of those meals. you are having to many protein shakes during the day. i would switch meal 1 to eggs, (2 whole eggs, 10 egg whites). add in some veggies (broccoli, green beans, etc.)

your diet is basically sound, just a few things that needs to be tweaked. more healthy fats (natural peanut butter, fish oil, Extra Virgin Olive Oil, etc..)

[redback]

you are 5'10, you eat all that and you only weigh 155, i suspect you havnt been eating that volume of food for too long, even if your metabolisim was extremly high at 5'10 you should way more.

[3quin0x]

Ive always eaten that much but certainly not as healthy consistently throughout the many years. The shakes were about one a day until around 2 months ago.

[babyblues]

I apologize if this is gross, but how do you know if you have a tape worm or something? I can't help but wonder if something like that is possible.

[3quin0x]

HA! It's been mentioned, but I'm not feeling tired, looking pale, or showing any of the signs, I dont think. If I do, Ive had it since I can remember......bet that thing is HUGE by now ;P it has been mentioned though

[THE BOUNCER]

so have you done anything to change? have you added in some extra cals etc?

[fog_hat1981]

First of all 4% is show ready and I highly highly highly doubt you're actually that low - BUT - if you somehow actually are that low you need to get it up around at least 6% or 7% to "stay" healthy (but I suggest you get more than 3 or 4 "opinions"/tests)...

As for your diet it isn't what you think it is - your carbs are not nearly high enough for your body type (and nowhere near the 400-600 range you implied) - you might be hitting close to 250-300 with the rice you're eating (but the carbs you may be getting from your xxl shake are not low gi and should be replaced)....

B was right in saying your diet is pretty much solid BUT that's only if you're wishing to maintain what you've got and that's obviously not what you want or you wouldn't have made this post - you need to cut your meals down to around 4 or 5 a day, cut your shakes and up your low gi carbs significantly - you'll have to drink tons of water/coffee to work through the hunger you'll initially experience but it'll get easier as your metabolism slows......

The good thing about this is that you'll teach your body new things and you'll most likely end up in better shape than you are now if you ever diet like you have been again....

[THE BOUNCER]

Originally Posted by fog_hat1981

you need to cut your meals down to around 4 or 5 a day, cut your shakes and up your low gi carbs significantly - you'll have to drink tons of water/coffee to work through the hunger you'll initially experience but it'll get easier as your metabolism slows......

I don't agree with that fog. I feel that simply incorporating some healthy fats into those meals will help him gain some quality pounds.

can you go into a little more detail about why you think he needs to cut his meals down to as low as 4 a day? not trying to be argumentative at all, just trying to understand the reasoning.

Basically I think what you are trying to do is slow his metabolism. My thought is, let his metabolism stay high and just add more quality calories. Let me know what your thoughts are on that.

[rado]

Originally Posted by THE BOUNCER

My thought is, let his metabolism stay high and just add more quality calories. Let me know what your thoughts are on that.

I agree with this somewhat...With his stats, it would not do any harm to slow his metabolism down a bit in order to add some weight...Having a higher metabolism will only make it harder for him...If his metabolism is that high & unless he's eating 4K-5K cals a day, he's not going to get anywhere.

[fog_hat1981]

Originally Posted by THE BOUNCER

I don't agree with that fog. I feel that simply incorporating some healthy fats into those meals will help him gain some quality pounds.

I've seen some folks who can gain weight from adding in fats BUT I know just as many people who use "clean" fats in their cutting diets as opposed to carbs for their caloric needs and often times have better results cutting this way (I actually discussed this with VenomX shortly after meeting him at a show in AL about a month ago - we both agreed that he cut well on a high fat diet as do I and several people I know who compete). I'm not saying that adding fats won't help him add any weight but it probably won't help with him adding bodyfat as his system is already running like a freight train/machine as it is - it'll only learn to metabolize it and burn it off just as fast...

Originally Posted by THE BOUNCER

can you go into a little more detail about why you think he needs to cut his meals down to as low as 4 a day? not trying to be argumentative at all, just trying to understand the reasoning.

For starters our bodies burn calories when we eat/drink (thermic food index) and when you eat more often you can drastically increase the amount of calories your body burns just to digest the food you eat AND it increases your "resting" metabolism - at this point the poor guy's metabolism is burning faster than he can eat - if he can back off on the frequency of his meals while still maintaining the same caloric intake at the same ratio (but maybe upping carbs/fats in conjunction with each other) he will slow things down just a bit and pick up some bf which is what he's looking for (and what he needs considering 4% isn't a healthy level to maintain for very long)....

Originally Posted by THE BOUNCER

Basically I think what you are trying to do is slow his metabolism. My thought is, let his metabolism stay high and just add more quality calories. Let me know what your thoughts are on that.

That would work fine if we wanted to keep him lean and just add some muscle but he needs to get some more "healthy" bodyfat on his bones to get to a healthier level than where he is at. This approach would work great for someone who's trying to put on lean mass - just not for adding bf......


All in all I believe it comes down to drastic changes at this point - if he makes subtle changes like just adding fats he won't see that much of a difference and since we're actually looking to add some bf to his system we don't need to take %steps like when I would lay out a cutting program - let him add on 3% or 4% of bf and then slowly add in another meal or two and he'll stay nice and lean (but at a healthy level this time) while adding some muscle in the process (which only serves to increase his metabolism more which is another reason we need to slow it down at this point) - all just my opinion/depth of knowledge but I hope it helps....

[THE BOUNCER]

Originally Posted by fog_hat1981

I've seen some folks who can gain weight from adding in fats BUT I know just as many people who use "clean" fats in their cutting diets as opposed to carbs for their caloric needs and often times have better results cutting this way (I actually discussed this with VenomX shortly after meeting him at a show in AL about a month ago - we both agreed that he cut well on a high fat diet as do I and several people I know who compete). I'm not saying that adding fats won't help him add any weight but it probably won't help with him adding bodyfat as his system is already running like a freight train/machine as it is - it'll only learn to metabolize it and burn it off just as fast...




For starters our bodies burn calories when we eat/drink (thermic food index) and when you eat more often you can drastically increase the amount of calories your body burns just to digest the food you eat AND it increases your "resting" metabolism - at this point the poor guy's metabolism is burning faster than he can eat - if he can back off on the frequency of his meals while still maintaining the same caloric intake at the same ratio (but maybe upping carbs/fats in conjunction with each other) he will slow things down just a bit and pick up some bf which is what he's looking for (and what he needs considering 4% isn't a healthy level to maintain for very long)....




That would work fine if we wanted to keep him lean and just add some muscle but he needs to get some more "healthy" bodyfat on his bones to get to a healthier level than where he is at. This approach would work great for someone who's trying to put on lean mass - just not for adding bf......


All in all I believe it comes down to drastic changes at this point - if he makes subtle changes like just adding fats he won't see that much of a difference and since we're actually looking to add some bf to his system we don't need to take %steps like when I would lay out a cutting program - let him add on 3% or 4% of bf and then slowly add in another meal or two and he'll stay nice and lean (but at a healthy level this time) while adding some muscle in the process (which only serves to increase his metabolism more which is another reason we need to slow it down at this point) - all just my opinion/depth of knowledge but I hope it helps....

i agree with all the details you discuss in your post. however, the bottom line is this. if he can consume more calories then he is burning he will put on weight. fats, carbs, protein etc.. he is already getting a good amount of carbs and protein but he is a little low on fats. i feel that by adding them in he will get the results he is looking for.

[fog_hat1981]

Originally Posted by THE BOUNCER

the bottom line is this. if he can consume more calories then he is burning he will put on weight. fats, carbs, protein etc

I can't argue with the end result of this viewpoint at all - I just think he'll get faster and more noticeable results that he can sustain for a longer period of time if he does something more drastic - either way he's gotta try one or the other to at least start the process - I'm anxious to hear what works for him in this case as everything seems to be a learning process when it comes to things like this...

[THE BOUNCER]

Originally Posted by fog_hat1981

I can't argue with the end result of this viewpoint at all - I just think he'll get faster and more noticeable results that he can sustain for a longer period of time if he does something more drastic - either way he's gotta try one or the other to at least start the process - I'm anxious to hear what works for him in this case as everything seems to be a learning process when it comes to things like this...

i agree.

[3quin0x]

awesome insight gentlemen....thank you. I went the other day to get my bf done by a trained prof. and it came out at 4.1% using the hand tool. The past few days I have deducted 2 meals from my daily intake and since I ran out of shakes 2 days ago I have only had time to grab one at the gym. BF% has gone up 1% but my hunger man....its fierce. Im going to grab some more protein and incorp. more fats. I see what both of you cats are saying, but I feel that if my body is hungry I need to feed it. But I also see how I am enabling my metabo. to be this elevated by eating so much so Im going with B's method first then I think Im going to try fog's. Both sound. Ill throw some pics up for you here shortly. Redneck and I are going to hit the gym later today so Ill start the progress pics there.

[FitnessBrat]

Palm tanita/hand tool - are you using the "sensors" that you hold onto with your hands?

[3quin0x]

yeah that was the first one that shows E4(?) when I put in all the info. But to get any reading off of it I had to put it in saying I was 5'8. Im 5'10. I (meaning a trainer)did the hand tool one the other day and it was a 4.1.

[fog_hat1981]

I'm not going to dismiss your readings/situation altogether but I'll tell you this - I'm 5'8", 220/225 with abs/serratus showing plain as day with a 30/31" waist (roughly 7%/maybe 8% bf) and that damn machine at my work shows me at 27% bf!!!

Just food for thought....

[3quin0x]

yeah, I was thinking that muscle density might have something to do with it. Maybe? But you can see ripples in my ass if I flex so I know its low. But like I said I had that other one done and it was .1% higher. But lemme ask you this, is it good or bad to stay at that %? Ive heard some say its fine and others say its risky. There are obvious draw backs to being naturally low but heart wise, etc., are the any substantiated negative side effects?