sooooo tired and frustrated and ready to cry

[dick0375]

I am just frustrated. I have not solved the fat loss puzzle yet. I don't see changes in the way my clothes look. It seems like my upper body has made changes, but my lower half is still HUGE!!!

I have been dieting for over 8 weeks - the first 7 weeks on one diet and the last week on a new diet I found on the website posted by red. Here are the vitals

160 lb., bf% estimated at 20-23%
1 hr. cardio 6x a week (sometimes 7)
weights for 20-30 min. moderate weight after each cardio session
diet: around 1500 cals, about 230 g protein (15 oz. chicken breast, 12 egg whites + 1 yolk, mrp's, about 35 g carb (broccoli and grapefruit - how many carbs in grapefruit?) - use no cal butter spray
no dairy
flax and fish oils
at least 3.5-4 quarts of water (do use crystal light to mix it up)


Please tell me I'm doing everything right and that it just takes time!! Or help me correct what is wrong. I really am looking for a sign that this is all working.

[Puddles]

Awww, hun, we'll get it figured out somehow! It sure does suck when you're trying so hard and you don't see results.

Let me ask you this...is the diet you just listed what you've been doing for the last week or for the 7 weeks prior?

Please provide say 2 or 3 days worth of meal plans (both what you were doing a month ago and what you're doing now). I know that's gonna be a pain in the ass to type out, but do it anyway. Include what time of the day you're eating plus when in the day you're doing your training.

Hang in there girl. Something's gotta give and we'll figure out what it is!

How old are you too?

I know for me, at 1500 cal's I will not loose bf. no matter how heavy I train or how much cardio I do. I have a very slow metabolism and I'm 38 y.o. at 5'3" around 13% bf. I just slipped below the 150 mark at 149...been workin on it for months. I'm finally getting my diet tweaked to what my body works well with.

[dick0375]

I'm 24 and below is the diet I started this past week:

M1 (7 or 7:30 am): 5 egg whites, 1 whole egg
1/2 grapefruit
3 oz. chicken or turkey
1 fish oil cap
M2 (9:30 or 10): Shake w/ strawberries, 1 tsp of flax oil
M3 (12 or 12:30): 6oz. chicken, turkey or fish
2c. green veggies
1 fish oil cap
M4 (3:00): Same as 2
M5 (5:00): Same as 3
M6 (7:00): 6 egg white omelet

I try to have (2) 30 min. workouts - one in the morning around 9:30 and one in the evening.

This is the type of meal I was eating for the first 7 weeks. I would also vary it up by substituting mrp's at 2 meals on alternative weeks and for a change of snack sometimes, I would make a whey protein shake.

Meal 1: 1/2 cup (dry) oatmeal, cooked with 2 scoops whey protein

Meal 2: 6 egg whites, scrambled with broccoli and Pam-saut‚ed onions

Meal 3: 6 oz. chicken breast; 4 oz. yam; 1 cup steamed cauliflower

Snack: 6 oz. turkey breast; 1/2 cup fresh red pepper slices

Meal 4: 6 oz. cod, simmered in pan with 2 Tbsp. salsa; 8 asparagus spears; 1 small salad with Dijon-balsamic vinegar dressing

I was doing cardio on this diet around 90-110 minutes (now I think, way too much!), but that was what the diet specified in order to loose the fat in 12 weeks.

My metabolism has been beaten up. First I lost weight, then I gained it back, then I lost the weight again and got down to 130lb, but I pretty much did not provide my system with protein and I lost muscle mass. I was unhealthy. Now, I've gained it all back during the past year. I'm ready to cry. Even my "fat jeans" the ones I wore over 3 years ago are starting to get tight. There's nothing worse than that. I just want to slim down the right way and keep my sanity in the process. I'm willing to work hard and keep my diet clean to see fast results. I need my self esteem back.

Thank you so much for responding Puddles!

[Mr incredible]

Your diet looks pretty good.

Your training looks toooo much. 6 x 1 hr cardio per week is gonna suck all your energy, and if your gonna do both cardio and weights on the same day then do the weights first.

you should keep that protien level but vary your carbohydrate intake, up for a couple of days (e.g. weekend) and down to what your intake is above for 4-5 days.

I think that your progress will slow if you keep hammering yourself the way you seem to be. Regular cardio sessions are good but shouldn't be too intense, I think 30-40 minutes at a hr of above 125bpm but below 160 is enough if done say 3 time per week. In terms of weights train your whole body over 3-4 workouts (i.e. split up the body parts).

It sounds as if your doing too much cardio and as a result your burning away chances of improved muscle tone. If you don't rest up and sleep enough in between workouts or overtrain by doing too regular workouts or too much cardio then you wont recouperate in time for your next workout and you won't improve your athletic performance, fitness and muscle tone.

More muscle equates a faster metabolic rate, your not gonna achieve that by overtraining, and you may make your self run down and susceptable to illness as well as depression through glycogen (energy) depletion, not to mention supress your endocrine (hormone) system and slow down your metabolic rate.

Take a step back, moderate your cardio regime, keep eating healthy, get your vitamins B's and C's and get pleanty of rest between workouts. Think beyond how many calories you have burned and think more about improving your athleticism and well being.

Rome wasn't built in a day and drastically loosing weight isn't good for anybody.

good luck

[lordikon]

Originally posted by dick0375
I am just frustrated. I have not solved the fat loss puzzle yet. I don't see changes in the way my clothes look. It seems like my upper body has made changes, but my lower half is still HUGE!!!

I have been dieting for over 8 weeks - the first 7 weeks on one diet and the last week on a new diet I found on the website posted by red. Here are the vitals

160 lb., bf% estimated at 20-23%
1 hr. cardio 6x a week (sometimes 7)
weights for 20-30 min. moderate weight after each cardio session
diet: around 1500 cals, about 230 g protein (15 oz. chicken breast, 12 egg whites + 1 yolk, mrp's, about 35 g carb (broccoli and grapefruit - how many carbs in grapefruit?) - use no cal butter spray
no dairy
flax and fish oils
at least 3.5-4 quarts of water (do use crystal light to mix it up)


Please tell me I'm doing everything right and that it just takes time!! Or help me correct what is wrong. I really am looking for a sign that this is all working.

Take measurements. When I first started working out I gained 18 lbs before I even noticed a slight change. Even with my before/after pictures it was hard to see. But my measurements told me I'd gained 3/4" on the biceps, and various other gains....etc.

If you're weight lifting you could be gaining muscle and losing fat, so a scale might not help you. You just need some more time, that diet sounds good for your size. Maybe put on some more muscle and with that alone you'll burn a little more fat each day.

[cowgirl]

I agree with both of the above posts.

First lets talk about the amount of cardio you are doing. I've done what you are doing cardio wise & could never lose anything. And I was always hungry from the cardio. Last year I took off more than 25 lbs of fat & did no cardio in the process. It can be done! It took alot of reading & research to convience me. I also started out at 1600cals per day & by the end of the 3rd month I was eating 2000 cals a day. I found if I hit 2100, I would start to gain.

I started to stall in my weight loss & added in cycling my carbs. It was just what I needed & the weight loss started up again. I was lifting heavy so my body needed more calories.

Cardio is a catch 22.

The more you do the more muscle you burn,
The more muscle you burn, the less calories you need.
The less calories you eat, the less your muscles will grow.
and then you need even less calories per day.

Make sense?

Second point, measurements not the scale. You dramatically change you bodies composition with excersize.

[dick0375]

Thank you for all of your advice and words of encouragement. I truly appreciate it.

So, from what I understand... I am to continue with red's diet of 230 g protein, etc. and cut down the cardio ot 30-40 minutes 4/5 days per week and continue with light weight high rep weight training (I am not trying to bulk up - I want to be lean ). I am naturally muscular and I want my body to be tight and toned.

Sound good?

Thanks everyone

[GearTripper]

Originally posted by dick0375
diet: around 1500 cals, about 230 g protein[/b]

waaaaaayyyy too much protein unless you're 200lbs and a body-builder lifting heavy weights, which i assume you're not as you've mentioned trying to tone.

M2 (9:30 or 10): Shake w/ strawberries, 1 tsp of flax oil

specifically, what kind of shake are you using and very specifically, what is in the serving? seeing as you take three per day, i am very curious. also... i would go soo far as to say you are eating too much if the desire is to loose weight. you mentioned the desire to be lean, so i understand that much but you're going to put on some serious weight eating what you're eating regardless of your workouts which may in turn might help distort the body composition.

diet: around 1500 cals, about 230 g protein (15 oz. chicken breast, 12 egg whites + 1 yolk, mrp's, about 35 g carb (broccoli and grapefruit - how many carbs in grapefruit?) - use no cal butter spray[/b]

just trying to make sure i cover all the important bases... i think you miscalculated your caloric intake or you're using MRP's that aren't actually MRP's?!?! so again, make sure you specifically list what is in those shakes as there's high doubt in my mind that you're only getting 1500 calories taking in all that food WITH the additional 3 MRP's each day. something off, but won't know until we figure out what those shakes are. also, be wary of salt intake and bloat and watch out for simple sugars. feel free to PM me if i don't respond fast enough in this thread too.

i also would suggest slightly "spicing-up" your meals and they can get "boring". you are able to eat much more variety then egg whites and MRP's. furthermore, i think you're over-doing it with the eggs.. unless you're body-BUILDING, you shouldn't need half as much. please feel free to reference my girlfriends diet (HERE), but minus the additional protein shakes in your case

[dick0375]

You are the first person to say that my protein consumption is too much and I COMPLETELY AGREE. I have noticed since starting the diet, that I HAVE GAINED weight. That is what has gotten me so upset. That did not seem right to me if the goal was actually to loose weight. I did not like the way that after eating I was always soooo full and I do not like eating all those eggs.

I am actually only consuming 2 shakes per day - 2 scoops per shake. I don't have the bottle in front of me now, but I do know that each scoop is 130 calories, 40 g of protein and 4 g of carbs. I purchased it at GNC.

Thank you so much for confirming my reservations. The diet your girlfriend follows would be applicable to my scenario, but I should not drink any of the shakes?

Knowing my stats, what should be a healthy caloric intake for me to loose body fat? (160lb, 5'6", bf of 20-23%)

So you agree with the 40 min. cardio sessions 3/4 times per week and moderate weight lifting at high reps? Should I do more cardio?

[GearTripper]

Originally posted by dick0375
You are the first person to say that my protein consumption is too much and I COMPLETELY AGREE. I have noticed since starting the diet, that I HAVE GAINED weight. That is what has gotten me so upset. That did not seem right to me if the goal was actually to loose weight. I did not like the way that after eating I was always soooo full and I do not like eating all those eggs.

well, just so you're clear... you might gain more muscle mass which in turn is heavier then fat. as the others also mentioned above, don't pay attention to the scale, but rather take measurements and use the mirror. a quick general fat test is as easy as standing in front of a mirror and jumping up and down. that which wiggles is fat... that which remains stiff is muscle. (very broad explanation and take with a grain of salt)

I am actually only consuming 2 shakes per day - 2 scoops per shake. I don't have the bottle in front of me now, but I do know that each scoop is 130 calories, 40 g of protein and 4 g of carbs. I purchased it at GNC.

too much protein as i assumed. please try and list the GNC brand name and other stuff on the top portion of the serving lablel (fats/carbs/sodium/etc). for now i would cut back to 1 single scoop per shake twice per day. you should focus on getting around 20g of protein per sitting for your goals.

Thank you so much for confirming my reservations. The diet your girlfriend follows would be applicable to my scenario, but I should not drink any of the shakes?

feel free to adjust the meals to fit your taste-buds... but as you can see, it's relatively simple with more "real" tasty food with enough differences between meals that you won't get tired of eating the same ol thing every day. and yes, don't consume as many shakes. just use the meals as a guideline for what a meal should look like. i would suggest a shake in the AM andlate afternoon. pick at least 2 meals a day and make sure to get in a snack somewhere.

Knowing my stats, what should be a healthy caloric intake for me to loose body fat? (160lb, 5'6", bf of 20-23%)

try not to focus soo much on calories, but rather just make sure that the calories you ARE eating are GOOD calories. no sugars/fats/etc. if you must have a number <1500/day to start shedding pounds... but again, this is highly dependent upon your matabolism and workout routines. lots of water as usual.

So you agree with the 40 min. cardio sessions 3/4 times per week and moderate weight lifting at high reps? Should I do more cardio?

40-45 minute sessions 3-4/wk & moderate weights 12-15 rep sets for the first month. as your strength increases, i personally feel that a womans body can take shape much faster doing heavy weights in the 10 rep range... but for now, keep it slightly higher.

[GearTripper]

another thing i forgot to add, is try not to eat meals at least 3-4 hours before you go to bed... very important! a very light snack is ok, though... no sweets or fats though

[cowgirl]

Yeah............Gear & you are right. If you don't want to build nuscle cut ot the protein & keep doing all that cardio! Those high reps with moderate weights will also help insure you don't gain any unsightly muscle.

[Pumpdogg]

I agree with geartripper, I think you posted another thread a few weeks back and I had intended to post a reply but my wife had some major surgery and I have not been on the board really at all. I think with Trippers adjustments you will see a difference. Dont beleive the hype that you can not eat to much protein or that it will not make you fat, that is just not true, and try changing up your cardio.
What I mean by that, is get on an exercise bike that you can stand up on or a treadmill and run or pedal at 85% max for 20 seconds then slow down to 60% 30 seconds repeat this cycle for 20 minutes. Next day you do carido try 10 second sprint at 85% and 15 seconds at 60 %. This is a far better way to burn bodyfat than standard long distance cardio.
Keep your head up it is a slow process for allot of us, like I have been on a diet for 7 weeks and have lost only 9 pounds, but everyweek my lifts continue to increase and my body comp continually changes, if I relyed on the scale I would be freaking out by now. YOU CAN DO IT, say that when you feel like gowing home and not finishing a workout. Im 30 now and most of the people I went to high shcool with look terrible and here I look better. We are always more critical of ourselves than other people which can sometimes be a bad trait. YOu can do it

PD

[dick0375]

Hi GearTripper,

Once again, thanks for all the help. Here are the stats on the protein powder. I purchased it at GNC and its name is AMPLIFY by RELEASE (Dietary Supplement, Advanced amino acid blend).

Serving: 1 scoop
130 cals (18 cals from fat)
Total fat: 2 g
Sodium: 50mg
Total Carb: 4g
Protein: 20g

[GearTripper]

Originally posted by dick0375
Hi GearTripper,

Once again, thanks for all the help. Here are the stats on the protein powder. I purchased it at GNC and its name is AMPLIFY by RELEASE (Dietary Supplement, Advanced amino acid blend).

Serving: 1 scoop
130 cals (18 cals from fat)
Total fat: 2 g
Sodium: 50mg
Total Carb: 4g
Protein: 20g

that's a protein supplement and not what i would call an MRP... but close i would stick to as i suggested above, and keep us informed as to how the workouts are coming. good luck!

[redsquirrel]

I recommended the protein consumption to be around 200 first of all.

Secondly, she is wanting to MAINTAIN her muscle. If she is doing the amount of cardio and weights she is, she will end up where she was before: starvation mode. She has to be getting enough protein to maintain her muscularity, and not burn the muscle.

dick- if you thought my recommendations were not in line, you should have said something.

Also, you said yourself you've noticed your upper body getting better, so obviously something is working. You need to give your body AT LEAST 2-3 weeks to see a decent change. A woman's upper body will 99% of the time come around faster than the lower half, because the lower half is where most women store thier fat. It takes a long time to burn it off.

BTW- when I was dieting for my contest, i ate at least 250 gms of protein/ day to maintain the muscle and burn the fat. It wasn't until 5 weeks into the diet that I dropped my last meal. If you don't eat 3-4 hours before bed, you're talking at least 14 hours of fasting which will only lead to putting your body BACK into starvation mode. That is why I recommended the egg white meal, and a 12 HR fasting time. Long enough to burn fat, and NOT MUSCLE.

You've noticed differences, and like others said, just because the scale weight has increased doesn't mean shit. It sounds like you gained muscle and LOST FAT, which I thought was the goal. But then again, I must not know what the hell I'm talking about. Your protein consumption is fine. It accomodates your weight training, AND your cardio. You will not build muscle, you'll maintain it. And as I've told you before, you were doing too much cardio.

[dick0375]

Red-

The only reason I questioned the diet was because of the way I was feeling and looking. I seemed to be bloated all the time and I sometimes had to force myself to finish the food and then I feltl sick and lethargic and my muscles were swollen.

I think now that might have been due to overtraining (no rest days )

The positive about the diet is that I don't feel deprived and I'm never hungry and I actually feel like I eat too much (Oddly enough though, calorically speaking I'm just wondering if I should actually add more cals based on my BMR of 2500 cals and my activity

I have cut back cardio to 40-45 min 4 days a week and 15/20 min. of weight training.?)

Just trying to find a plan that works with my body - didn't mean to offend you.

[redsquirrel]

Originally posted by dick0375
Red-

The only reason I questioned the diet was because of the way I was feeling and looking. I seemed to be bloated all the time and I sometimes had to force myself to finish the food and then I feltl sick and lethargic and my muscles were swollen.

I think now that might have been due to overtraining (no rest days )

The positive about the diet is that I don't feel deprived and I'm never hungry and I actually feel like I eat too much (Oddly enough though, calorically speaking I'm just wondering if I should actually add more cals based on my BMR of 2500 cals and my activity

I have cut back cardio to 40-45 min 4 days a week and 15/20 min. of weight training.?)

Just trying to find a plan that works with my body - didn't mean to offend you.

It's not necessarily that I'm offended, but when I take the time to write out a diet, I expect someone to follow it for the most part. If they have questions, I do my best to answer them. I'm not as thorough with others who ask for help. I will commit to someone who I feel has the discipline to follow a stringent diet.

In the first couple of weeks, you will feel a little full.....almost like you are bulking. Your body has to get used to you not starving it all the time. One of the main goals here is to get your body to a point where it is constantly burning just about whatever you put in it. Once your body does adjust, you will notice yourself getting hungry sometimes just 2 hours after your last meal. If you are feeling sick from the additional food, try cutting back each portion for the time being. And in a couple of weeks, we may even throw in a cheat meal.

The number for your BMR can be deceiving. That number is not one for someone who wants to lose weight. That's the number you should eat to maintain your body how it is. Also, since you have cut back the cardio and increased your protein, I would say you could increase your weight training by 5-10 minutes. As for the bloatedness, increase your water intake, and it should subside.

I know you don't know what to expect, so just try and be patient and let the diet do it's work. Trust the advice and guidance I have given you. I promise you it will work.

[GearTripper]

holy cow... i'm not sure what to say except the i highly disagree with the advice that was given...

160 lb., bf% estimated at 20-23%

20-23%bf... estimated, which is probably moreso in reality. don't mean to sound mean, but the majority of individulas don't have a clue as to accurately measuring their bodyfat ratio. what muscle is she trying to maintain? there's absolutely no logical reason why she would need to consume anywhere near 200 grams of protein per day. she's not a body-builder, not doing fitness competitions, not a model in fitness, at least not that i'm aware of or have been informed. "real" people need diets with "real" food or the diets won't work. what average person is gonna eat egg whites three times a day for months at a time. the average person isn't that disciplined... or they wouldn't be average and on here asking for help. hell, why not tell her throw in some anavar while she's at it? and if she's really desperate, some test.. then we'll go into some clen and eca stacks and maybe some anti-e's to battle the bloat. she's a normal person first and foremost. i just don't know where to go with this anymore. i stand by my suggestions.

[cowgirl]

Geez Gear, just because it's a tight diet doesn't mean Dick is so weak willed that she shouldn't even try it.

Her coming on the board & even mentioning Red's diet & how she thinks it is wrong for her is just plain RUDE! Red put time into this & at least Dick could have said "thanks but no thanks" instead of posting the way she did.

My last point is that Red's phylosiphy on diet/muscle/protien/cardio is what women need to be doing, not the starvation mode style of thinking that spirals a woman into a "fat-skinny" person.

I lost 28lbs while slowly increasing my calories. So it can be done. I guarentee it's a better life choice than having to always eat 1200 cals and loosing whatever tiny amount of muscle that you DO have! Sure I'm into muscle building & Dick might not be, but with as little muscle as she is sporting I doubt the 6-8 rep range with super heavy weights would hurt her. We all know it takes years to get big.

It might actually build some muscle & burn some calories rather than your style of burn the muscle & cut the calories.

[sana]

Originally posted by GearTripper
holy cow... i'm not sure what to say except the i highly disagree with the advice that was given...

160 lb., bf% estimated at 20-23%

20-23%bf... estimated, which is probably moreso in reality. don't mean to sound mean, but the majority of individulas don't have a clue as to accurately measuring their bodyfat ratio. what muscle is she trying to maintain? there's absolutely no logical reason why she would need to consume anywhere near 200 grams of protein per day. she's not a body-builder, not doing fitness competitions, not a model in fitness, at least not that i'm aware of or have been informed. "real" people need diets with "real" food or the diets won't work. what average person is gonna eat egg whites three times a day for months at a time. the average person isn't that disciplined... or they wouldn't be average and on here asking for help. hell, why not tell her throw in some anavar while she's at it? and if she's really desperate, some test.. then we'll go into some clen and eca stacks and maybe some anti-e's to battle the bloat. she's a normal person first and foremost. i just don't know where to go with this anymore. i stand by my suggestions.

why do you have to get so militant towards ideas you don't agree with?

you don't agree with one simple point - the total amount of protein intake this girl needs to preserve muscle while losing fat. and you insinuate that RS is recommending ECA and anavar? give me a fucking break.

if indeed she wants to look "tone" this means she wants to look like a girl with muscle and low body fat. there are two seperate parts to this equation. and as anyone here would tell you - you can only do one thing at a time successfully. if she already has not much muscle - there's nothing wrong with her trying to preserve her muscle while she diets by keeping her protein intake high. the "high" is a relative thing that she needs to find for herself. high for me is about 180 grams which actually builds muscle on me.

from having seen pics of your girlfriend, i understand that you like women who don't look like they have much muscle - so while you may put your girlfriend on a diet that gives her say 100grams of protein a day - it doesn't mean that's necessairly what this girl needs. you haven't see her picture, and you're not completely clear of what her goal is other than to shed bf. each body style that is desired is achieve by eating different diets.

and honestly - the diet she outlined from RS isn't even that bad. it has fruits and moderate carbs. it is not a starvation or a horribly hard to follow diet. if she feels that 200 grams a day of protein is honestly too much for her - she's a grown up and can try to tweak the protein intake to see what works best for her.

why in the world you would come off so militant is beyond me.