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Old 02-11-18, 06:39 PM
First Tren Cycle Advice
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I'm looking to run my first Tren cycle and would like some advice on my gear. Here's what I'm planning:

CYCLE:
WK 1-8: 45MG TrenA ED (315MG weekly)
WK 1-8: 25MG TestP ED (175MG weekly)
WK 1-8: .25MG Cabergoline (Dostinex) 2x WK
WK 1-8: .5MG Arimidex EOD (ONLY if needed)

HCG:
WK 1-6: 250IUs HCG 2x WK
WK 7: 750IUs HCG ED for last 3 days
WK 7: .25MG Arimidex on day 4

PCT:
WK 9-13: Nolvadex 40/40/20/20/10
WK 9 on Supplements: Testojack 200, D-Aspartic Acid, DHEA, Indole 3 Carbinol, Resveratrol, ZMA

Here's some random thoughts on how I arrived at this plan:
* I chose Tren mainly because of its reputation for promoting lean mass gains
* The Tren dosage is relatively low which fits well with my inexperience (but should still give good results)
* I'm using TrenA due to potential unknown sides with me since its HL is short
* I'm going to run with ED pins to keep blood levels smooth
* The TestP dosage seems to be all that's needed with Tren and should help keep sides low
* I'm using Caber to address the Prolactin issue with Tren (and keep my libido up during cycle)
* I'm going to keep some Arimidex on hand but I'm not expecting to need it during cycle with the lower Test dosage
* I'm using HCG to prevent testicular atrophy and keep natural Test production going
* The .25MG Arimidex on WK 7, day 4 of HCG is to minimize estrogen due to the extra HCG shock

I feel pretty confident about the TrenA & TestP dosages and the Caber usage. I'm a little less confident in the HCG protocol and PCT. Any advice on any of the above is certainly appreciated!

As for me, I'm early 50s, 5'7", 170lbs, around 14%BF. Very experienced in the gym but fairly new to AAS, only running a couple of Sustanon cycles so far. My goals are primarily improved body composition with the addition of some lean mass also very desirable. Reducing sides and of course minimizing any potential negative long term effects is also very important to me.
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Old 02-11-18, 11:21 PM
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Old 02-12-18, 05:44 AM
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Seems pretty well thought out.I have no experience with tren so I have no comments. We are in the same age group so I'll be watching to see how this goes. Post up a log. Good luck with the run.

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Old 02-12-18, 01:02 PM
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i would run the caber only if needed.

also realize that tren comes with some harsh mental effects for some people. be aware of it bro.

other then that it looks good brother.
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Old 02-12-18, 02:30 PM
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i would run the caber only if needed.

also realize that tren comes with some harsh mental effects for some people. be aware of it bro.

other then that it looks good brother.
Thanks, I've heard that from others about the Caber. I just definitely want to keep it on hand in case there are sexual side effects (8 weeks is a long time, lol).

And yeah I've heard that there can be some metal sides to be aware of, although a lot of what I've read seem to indicate that some of it at least has been due to too much Test in the mix competing for the same receptors as the Tren (thus the pretty low Test dosage in my cycle). I consider myself pretty strong mentally but it's definitely something I'll want to be watching (and probably ask a bro or too to help me monitor as well).
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Old 02-12-18, 09:35 PM
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315mg tren weekly is about right on for first time users. At least in my opinion. I miss tren but I get the tren cough way to much. It does cause some strange dreams and night sweats but youll be fine if your aware of what the side effects can be.
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Old 02-12-18, 09:36 PM
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315mg tren weekly is about right on for first time users. At least in my opinion. I miss tren but I get the tren cough way to much. It does cause some strange dreams and night sweats but youll be fine if your aware of what the side effects can be.
Thank you for the encouragement! Did you run a similar low level of Test? What about Caber & HCG? I'd love to hear any feedback on how your run went, especially your PCT.
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Old 02-12-18, 09:39 PM
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For anyone following, here's a pretty good link on HCG that significantly influenced my thought process. I'd love to hear any feedback, especially from anyone who has used HCG in the past.

Human Chorionic Gonadotropin (HCG) Unraveled
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Old 02-13-18, 05:47 AM
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What mig were your stust cycles and how was your ancelerie use? Did u do blood?
You have ur mind made up about tren, ok I understand. HCG put my estro out of control. Common protocol followed and it was uncontrollable. I crashed my estro fighting hcg driven gyno sides and with almost no estro on my blood work, gyno. There are other kinds of estro that are not measured with standard bloods. It will pump those testicles up though. Why, if you are 50+, are you including HCG?
Take ur test down to 125 prop a week.
For thought, tren is 5 times testosterone so at 200 migs of tren = 1 gram of test. Not exactly but according to the ratings. GREAT gain, cut or recomp can be made with 200 migs of tren, deca, eq, dhb, npp. Could ease it in and bring it up.
Dump the hcg during, I read the article, pop the hcg end of cycle.
HCG or the action from it is powerful and takes a few weeks to stop. Longer than test.to fade, much longer.
I'd start with a test cycle add hcg for a couple weeks and get the feel then bring tren in, If not, if u have the reaction I did u will be lost. I was experenced verry well, u wI'll think tren hell, beacuse of something that is much harder to control, HCG. What happened with me is not uncommon with hcg, even under a doctor supervision it happens. I have an idea why, but it's just a hunch.
Best of luck, ur cycle is verry well thought through and the best teacher is experence.


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Old 02-13-18, 11:54 AM
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What mig were your stust cycles and how was your ancelerie use? Did u do blood?
You have ur mind made up about tren, ok I understand. HCG put my estro out of control. Common protocol followed and it was uncontrollable. I crashed my estro fighting hcg driven gyno sides and with almost no estro on my blood work, gyno. There are other kinds of estro that are not measured with standard bloods. It will pump those testicles up though. Why, if you are 50+, are you including HCG?
Take ur test down to 125 prop a week.
For thought, tren is 5 times testosterone so at 200 migs of tren = 1 gram of test. Not exactly but according to the ratings. GREAT gain, cut or recomp can be made with 200 migs of tren, deca, eq, dhb, npp. Could ease it in and bring it up.
Dump the hcg during, I read the article, pop the hcg end of cycle.
HCG or the action from it is powerful and takes a few weeks to stop. Longer than test.to fade, much longer.
I'd start with a test cycle add hcg for a couple weeks and get the feel then bring tren in, If not, if u have the reaction I did u will be lost. I was experenced verry well, u wI'll think tren hell, beacuse of something that is much harder to control, HCG. What happened with me is not uncommon with hcg, even under a doctor supervision it happens. I have an idea why, but it's just a hunch.
Best of luck, ur cycle is verry well thought through and the best teacher is experence.
I kept the Sustanon cycles pretty basic, 500MG/wk and was able to keep Estro under control with Indole 3 Carbinol & Resveratrol so nothing to crazy there. I did not do labs but had no Estro symptoms to speak of.

As far as HCG goes, honestly I've only included it because it sounded like the "best" way to go. That being said, that by far has been the most controversial portion of my plan, which generates a lot of concern for me. Real life experiences like yours only tend to add to that concern.

While I certainly like to "optimize" things, I also prefer to keep things as simple as possible, especially when it comes to a lot of unknowns which this certainly is. So maybe the better question is "Is HCG really necessary?" In other words, especially at my age, is it likely I can run an 8 week Tren/Test cycle, run a standard Nolva PCT at the end, and everything "turns back on" successfully afterwards? THAT is really all that I care about and frankly is the reason I was incorporating HCG at all.

Oh and regarding the reduced dosages, that sounds like a good plan. I can easily start the Tren at 210MG/wk with my formulation and bump it up later if things are going well. The Test is a little harder to change (my formulation will be 250MG/ML so 1/10 ML (25MG) is about as precise as I can probably go with my gear). Maybe I'll do a 1ML and 1/2ML EOD scheme at least initially which would bring me down to around 135MG/wk on the Test though.

Anyway, I appreciate your feedback. Please let me know what you think about what I said regarding no HCG in the plan. Thanks!
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Old 02-14-18, 01:45 PM
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i would run the caber only if needed.

also realize that tren comes with some harsh mental effects for some people. be aware of it bro.

other then that it looks good brother.
I agree that i donít run cabergoline unless absolutely necessary.
The cycle looks very good. Tren is some powerful stuff!!! I get great results with doses as low as 25mg EOD.
You should notice very fast strength gain within a few days. Keep diet very clean and youíll put on lean mass.
Donít be afraid to lower the dose if you feel toxic. Tren feels great at first but quickly causes a crappy feeling in me now that Iím about 50 years old. Itís a tough one on the liver and kidneys.
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Old 02-15-18, 12:36 AM
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I kept the Sustanon cycles pretty basic, 500MG/wk and was able to keep Estro under control with Indole 3 Carbinol & Resveratrol so nothing to crazy there. I did not do labs but had no Estro symptoms to speak of.

As far as HCG goes, honestly I've only included it because it sounded like the "best" way to go. That being said, that by far has been the most controversial portion of my plan, which generates a lot of concern for me. Real life experiences like yours only tend to add to that concern.

While I certainly like to "optimize" things, I also prefer to keep things as simple as possible, especially when it comes to a lot of unknowns which this certainly is. So maybe the better question is "Is HCG really necessary?" In other words, especially at my age, is it likely I can run an 8 week Tren/Test cycle, run a standard Nolva PCT at the end, and everything "turns back on" successfully afterwards? THAT is really all that I care about and frankly is the reason I was incorporating HCG at all.

Oh and regarding the reduced dosages, that sounds like a good plan. I can easily start the Tren at 210MG/wk with my formulation and bump it up later if things are going well. The Test is a little harder to change (my formulation will be 250MG/ML so 1/10 ML (25MG) is about as precise as I can probably go with my gear). Maybe I'll do a 1ML and 1/2ML EOD scheme at least initially which would bring me down to around 135MG/wk on the Test though.

Anyway, I appreciate your feedback. Please let me know what you think about what I said regarding no HCG in the plan. Thanks!
I'm not opposed to hcg, just for me it was the one hell of a wild card. The protocol for end of cycle hcg use is a great way to stimulate recovery as androgens are no longer being added and nolva and anastrazol are in place for estro rebound imop.

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Old 02-15-18, 06:47 AM
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Cycle looks ggod bro, enjoy it!
Take update pics regularly cause Your body will change so fast you will miss it!

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Old 02-17-18, 09:42 PM
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Well thought out..almost too thought out.. if you know what I mean. I def don't think you'll need caber or adex. Definitely don't want to drive your estro down too far...being fairly early on in your AAS experience you may get sick of ED pins. Maybe make it simple and just do 100mg of both EOD? Either way good luck and enjoy.. you'll be wanting to up the tren no doubt..its the bees knees
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Old 02-19-18, 02:36 PM
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Well thought out..almost too thought out.. if you know what I mean. I def don't think you'll need caber or adex. Definitely don't want to drive your estro down too far...being fairly early on in your AAS experience you may get sick of ED pins. Maybe make it simple and just do 100mg of both EOD? Either way good luck and enjoy.. you'll be wanting to up the tren no doubt..its the bees knees
Haha well yeah I've definitely been guilty of overthinking some things in the past but I suppose that's a better "problem" than underthinking when it comes to stuff like this, lol. I absolutely plan on listening to my body though during the cycle and won't hesitate to play with things like Caber & Adex along the way as needed.

As far as the pinning goes, I definitely expect to get sick of ED but it's more of an AAS respect issue for me. Since I am fairly inexperienced and Tren is definitely powerful and new for me, I want to be able adjust (or even stop) things quickly based on how I respond. Sticking with TrenA & TestP in smaller ED dosages seems to be the way to go for me in that regard. Even though I know it's going to really suck, lol. Hopefully the results will make up for the 56 pins lmao!
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Old 02-19-18, 03:14 PM
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Always preach short esters. They work better and hit harder. Have you ever pinned with slin pins?
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Old 02-20-18, 08:29 AM
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I'd use Mast and Var instead of Tren but it looks fine...
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Old 02-20-18, 10:59 AM
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Always preach short esters. They work better and hit harder. Have you ever pinned with slin pins?
Long esters are much more powerful than short.

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Old 02-20-18, 11:32 AM
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Long esters are much more powerful than short.

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In which way? Msybe higher conversion to estro?
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Old 02-20-18, 02:27 PM
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In which way? Msybe higher conversion to estro?
they build up in the system in a way that short esters never can.
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Old 02-20-18, 03:22 PM
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they build up in the system in a way that short esters never can.
If I remember right, the shortened ester allows an overall higher peak hormone level. I guess it just depends on a person's individual idea of more powerful or more effective. I personally prefer to have much more control and effective active hormone that comes along with the short esters. Typically I run both simultaneously. Test E with prop.. deca with npp etc..
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Old 02-20-18, 03:26 PM
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If I remember right, the shortened ester allows an overall higher peak hormone level. I guess it just depends on a person's individual idea of more powerful or more effective. I personally prefer to have much more control and effective active hormone that comes along with the short esters. Typically I run both simultaneously. Test E with prop.. deca with npp etc..
No long esters build up and overlap creating a much higher peak.
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Old 02-20-18, 08:51 PM
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If I remember right, the shortened ester allows an overall higher peak hormone level. I guess it just depends on a person's individual idea of more powerful or more effective. I personally prefer to have much more control and effective active hormone that comes along with the short esters. Typically I run both simultaneously. Test E with prop.. deca with npp etc..
Ace feels stronger than tren-e bc it release so fast, but its metabolized completely or to about 12.5migs in 72 hours after one pins 100 migs. Pinning 100 migs a day, 700 a week of tren-a Ones blood saturation will reach about 250 to 300ish migs of tren ace with ester weight included at about day 7. If my calculation are correct. One may reach a bit higher than that due to their metabolism.
Using 500 tren e, 200 mig a week less than ace, ones blood will reach about 850ish in week 6. At 700 tren e blood saturation will be way over a gram in blood at week 6. All this hinges on the ester half lifes.
Imagen Tren e is a jet plane, it takes off and it takes a while to reach an altitude of 30,000 feet and levels out.
Imagen tren a as a prop plane and a max altitude of 10000 feet. U take off and climb and level out, verry fast.
Tren-A levels out in a weekish, tren e continues to steadily rase blood saturation for a 6 to 8 weeks.
There is a great article but it is encrypted/protected.
U guys can probably cut me up on the calculations did them in my head.
Game over, there is something about tren-a, it's just so fast, strong, yum. I favor the long esters bc of scar tissue, and I don't have to rotate. A glut shot renders up to 50% better absorbtion than delt. Better blood saturation with large muscle shots. Thnx for sharing ur cycle style. I never ran a cycle with both esters . Sounds good.
Do u run that way often?







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Old 02-21-18, 07:47 AM
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Do u run that way often?
I wont Hi-jack his thread any longer (sorry!) but I tend to do this instead of front loading, jump starting with an oral etc.. Run say 1g Test E with 500mg Test P - 900mg Tren E with 400-500mg Tren A - 800mg Primo and 350-500mg Mast P / per week phase orals in and out and almost do mini blasts with different short esters like replacing Tren A with NPP and Tren E with Deca etc..
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