My cycles are bombing, any suggestions

[Core]

I'm in week 8 of my 2nd steroid cycle.

Here is what I'm taking:

100mg test prop EOD
100mg tren acetate EOD

So far nothing much has happened on this cycle other than my body hair has been thinning out. My testicles are still at their normal size though so I'm not that badly suppressed yet.

My 1st cycle was:
300mg test prop every 3rd day

My first cycle was VERY painful and my butt was badly swolen for the entire 12 weeks I ran it. But I was able to put on 10lbs and 2 inches on my chest and had very good strength increases with pretty decent retention after 4 months of post cycle.

I ran this new cycle replacing half the test with tren to try to make the cycle less painful and more powerfull. Well I seem to have half succeeded as the injections have been pretty painless. But the cycle isn't really doing much. My sex drive isn't raging like it was on my 1st cycle and my friend thinks I'm suffering from low test levels as I'm losing some of my body hair.

My spotter thinks that I'm too much of a mutant for tren to work for me. He loves tren, but he has seen the way I've reacted to it and thinks there's something wrong with the way my body is processing it.

He does have a point. I have an auto-immune disease called spondyloarthropathy that is thought to be caused by genetic contamination with a bacterial agent. I've had this all my life so the contamination is spread out through out all my tissues. That does sort of make me a subtle mutation, but no major super powers have developed yet. :)

Another bizare thing is I ran the Andro test last year before my 1st cycle and rated with a score of 750+. The top value for a 20 yr old was supposed to be around 500. I'm in my 30's. That high level suggested I was already on AS as it was WAY above what was thought to be the norm. However I don't seem to have all that high of an anabolic potential. Is it possible I'm not as sensitive to anabolics so my body runs a high test level?

I need to figure out what I need to do to run better cycles. I've been using Synovex to make test prop and Component TH to make trenbolone acetate. I'd happily skip the trenbolone and do more than a gram of test prop a week if I could make the injections painless.

I don't know how to get my hands on other gear safely and affordably. Prohormones don't work for me so don't bother suggesting them. I waisted 2 years with no results on PH.

Any thoughts on how I can do better cycles safely?

Thanks.

[candle25]

The cycles might not be the problem. If your diet isn't in check you will just spin your wheels with AAS or anything else for that matter.

[Core]

Originally posted by candle25
The cycles might not be the problem. If your diet isn't in check you will just spin your wheels with AAS or anything else for that matter.

You have a point. I didn't mention this, but I should have as it is another problem I'm having with this cycle. One of the things a little screwy with this cycle is my appetite is shot.

I usually like to eat 7 times a day. 3 primaries, and 3 protien rich snacks and I'd normally be getting up around 2AM to eat some cottage cheese or something.

Right now I'm probably only eating 5 times a day.

On my first cycle my appetite was strange as well but in a different way. I could eat until I was full, but I would still feel hungry. I love test, but I hate how much of a pain in the butt the stuff can be. :)

If I could better continue with my normal diet I should be doing better.

I inittially thought I wouldn't worry about the lack of appetite. I thought that maybe I might lean out on the tren. That hasn't happened either as my body weight, although it has been fluctuating by 5lbs daily it is still about the same.

Here are some stats on me. I'm not very impressive sadly:

Age: 32
weight: 250lbs
height: 6'5"
chest: 46"
waist: 38"
bf: unknown but above 10%

trap bar Dead lift capacity: 425lbs and climbing
bench: 200lbs and basically stuck (sad eh?)

Chest is my weakest body part and is my constant focus. I change chest routines every 8 weeks to keep from over adapting.

Once I have a decent chest I plan on running some cutting cycles.

I'm wondering if I should just take the last of my gear and double the doses until it runs out and then start post cycle. My cycle will end short, but it might give me an idea if I'm just dosing things wrong.

700mg of tren a week seems excessive, but I could back off if I start feeling strange or start getting moody. I'm not worried about the test. I handle that well.

[GearTripper]

have you thought of trying a longer acting est. test like cypionate combined with deca/dbol? it will cut down the shots, stay in your system a whole lot longer and will put more size on you IMO.

[the_inkslinger]

you shouldnt get tons of size from either of those...BUT you should be eating alot ... my friends on tren now hewakes up in the middle of the ngiht starving and he is always hungry..
Have you noticed yourself getting hard at all ? Are you sure your gear is legit ? how's your strength ?

[ROCKETW19]

Originally posted by GearTripper
have you thought of trying a longer acting est. test like cypionate combined with deca/dbol? it will cut down the shots, stay in your system a whole lot longer and will put more size on you IMO.

yep you need cyp or enan. less shots=less pain in the ass! you could also rotate from ass to leg.

[NYDIRTYDOG]

yeah id go with a simple base cycle of either cyp/enenthate deca and dbols..that should put on some nice size for you...run maybe 750/mgs week enenthate split into 2 shots and 400 deca split into 2 spots...try 30mgs dbol for the first 6 weeks to jumpstart....looks like your only taking 3-400 mgs of test a week...also go to spotinjections.com and start to learn about shooting in other spots rather than just your ass..also make sure you have all your PCT's in order for when your done..and keep eating to gain mass...if you want..try some injectable b12 to maybe up your apetite a bit..hope this helps abit...

[Twix]

You should put on something with that combo. Evaluate everything and fix what you need to (eg. diet). If then it doesn't work I'd question the gear. Next time use the fina with some sust, you'll love it.

[Core]

As for the cyp/enth. I'd love to try them. Actually I wanted to do a enth/EQ cycle, but couldn't get my hands on the gear. This is just my 2nd cycle. The only safe source for AS I know of are implants and that limits me to test prop from Synovex and tren acetate from Finiplix-H or Component TH. :(

I have no trouble converting these into kits as I have a decent chemistry background.

Once I have the substances purified, removing methyl celulose and in the Synovex case also ester diol, I dry the powder and weigh it.

I then use Benzyl Benzoate as the primary solvent.

I create a 100mg/ml injectable with a volume ratio of:
1.5% BA
30% BB
68.5% Ethyl Oleate (this stuff rocks!)

The gear is legit. This is my 2nd cycle and my first test prop conversion was quite effective if not painfull.

I'm going to run an experiment. I have maybe 4 weeks of gear left. The cycle has been a wash. I've experienced no real changes in size or strength so far. I'm going to double the dose and see what happens. If I seem to kick in and the tren helps keep the prop from irritating even at the higher dose I can run another cycle in the fall with the same injectables.

As for the question of if I'm getting harder. Not really. Actually I think I'm looking soft.

Thanks everyone for the good advice. I admit the gear I'm using is not ideal for my goals. I'd probably be better of just running cutting cycles with this gear, but I'm afraid this is what I have to bulk with.

[NYDIRTYDOG]

find yourself another place to get more gear...thats hwat i would do

[acuman]

first of all, are you on any meds prescribed by the Dr?
how's the sleep? with good sleep, your appetite should improve.
get some new gear. FInd a place, they're out there.
Forget test prop, take a longer acting ester. Less shots, and there should be no pain.
If your body tends to run natural test levels high, then of course you'll need more aas to get above that.
What are your workouts like? there are seemingly endless types of workouts, evreyone reacts differently, and if every thing else is straightened out, you may want to shock the shit out of your body by doing different workouts, reps, sets, power lift. the only way the muscles get bigger is to have to do more work -- force them to failure with low reps.

....unless you've tried all that. just my 2 cents

[Core]

Originally posted by acuman
first of all, are you on any meds prescribed by the Dr?

The only medication I'm currently taking is Enbrel. Injected 3 times a week. Enbrel is a TNF-alpha blocker which does an awesome job at controlling the auto-immune disease. It not only stops the arthritis, it also stops the flu like symptoms and the clumsy staticy reception on my primary senses (hard to explain but the world is a lot realler on this medication). This is probably the 1st non growth inhibitting non liver toxic medication I've had in the last 25 years.

how's the sleep? with good sleep, your appetite should improve.

9 hours a night. I stay away from stimulants so I am very disciplined about getting the right amount of sleep to function.

get some new gear. FInd a place, they're out there.

Sigh. Wouldn't even know where to start. I could either smuggle from Mexico and risk getting caught, or order over the Internet and risk getting caught. I know of no one who runs cycles personally other than tren, test prop, and prohormones. :(

Forget test prop, take a longer acting ester. Less shots, and there should be no pain.
If your body tends to run natural test levels high, then of course you'll need more aas to get above that.

You offer good advice here. I just don't know how to follow it. :(

What are your workouts like? there are seemingly endless types of workouts, evreyone reacts differently, and if every thing else is straightened out, you may want to shock the shit out of your body by doing different workouts, reps, sets, power lift. the only way the muscles get bigger is to have to do more work -- force them to failure with low reps.

....unless you've tried all that. just my 2 cents

This is a big question. I've been lifting for 15 years. I moved to AZ when I realized I was losing all my muscle while I was sick in the winter months in MN and was failing to build back all the muscle in MN's short summers. Also the cold weather was hard on my health.

Since I've moved down here, I've put on more muscle than I ever achieved while I lived up north. From years of trial and error and a lot of reading and comparing of routines with others, I've come up with this approach which I've done well on up until this cycle:

I focus on a specific muscle group for a day's workout. So I have 4 different workout target groups:

Chest, back, shoulders, legs.

When I lift I will do 2-3 wamr up sets and then do 2 work sets with a targe of 8 reps. If I manage 8 reps on either work set, I up the weight for next week. About every 8 weeks I change the workout routine for the body part.

For instance here is my chest routine:
Bowflex Bench, dips, pullovers
Previous routine was:
Barbell bench, dips, pullovers
etc.

Every 3 weeks I take one of the 4 body parts and rest it. Right now I'm resting shoulders and working chest, back, and legs. I work chest twice a week for 4 workouts a week. On post cycle I will drop back to 3 workouts a week.

I try to keep the workouts under an hour.

With this approach I put on 2 inches on my chest with my first cycle and 1 inch on my chest in the 4 months of post cycle that followed. This cycle looks like I will fail to put on any chest girth as it is almost over. :(

Every once in a while I will do a special session of a pyramid, drop set, or 2-3 reps at a very high weight. I don't do this often and I don't ever seem to get all that great of results from these special workouts. Doing something like this might push my platue up 5-10 pounds and stall me again for instance.

I think the consensun is that I need better gear, and boy, that one stumps me.

[Mudge]

I dont understand why you say your body hair is thinning on test? Mine went up an insane amount from almost none to a veritable forest, it only increases never decreases on test.

I have encountered more than one person with zero results on synovex. You are obviously confident about the conversion but what if something else is at work here, if you dont notice an increased sex drive or the lifts going up at all then its bunk, I'd say its been damaged somehow.

I shoot prop and fina ED myself.

[house1]

have encountered more than one person with zero results on synovex. You are obviously confident about the conversion but what if something else is at work here, if you dont notice an increased sex drive or the lifts going up at all then its bunk, I'd say its been damaged somehow.

agreed

[Core]

Now in post cycle

I'm now a few days into post cycle.

Sex drive has picked up really well again and so has my appetite. Body weight's measuring 5lbs higher than it's max during cycle. Could be estrogen induced.

Using Nolvadex, Formestan, Tribilis, and Clen for post cycle.

I don't know what went wrong with the cycle. I tried upping the tren to 300mg EOD for the last 2 weeks and felt a little better, but not enough to salvage the cycle.

I did okay with the test prop at 700mg/week on my first cycle but had a LOT of pain to deal with. This cycle it never got higher than 500mg/week which since it was cut was painless, but probably too little test.

My strength didn't really increase on cycle nor did my mass, but people were telling me my shoulders were looking more muscular toward the end of the cycle. This is funny as I haven't worked my shoulders for 6 weeks as I wanted more workout days to work on my lagging chest. I just worked my shoulders recently and they are 20lbs weaker than before the rest so I don't know what change people are seeing. To me they look the same.

The problem with propionate is it converts to propionic acid which is HIGHLY toxic. Propionic acid is used as a microbacide and fungicide. Acetate converts to acetic acid which is also toxic, but not as bad. Acetic acid is used as an insecticide. I'm not certain either agrees with me.

I'm up for a second night time snack. Strange that NOW I'm hungry again at night. I'm still suspecting the main culprit on this cycle was the tren and not the test.

I'm undecided on how I want to run my 3rd cycle now this fall.

Thanks for everyone's help.