pro-hormones vs oral steroids ?

[shiko24]

Stats: 28y/o, 5'9", 205lbs, 11%bf. Training for 10 years. Currently off cycle.
My question is, would it be worth using a pro-hormone, such as methyl-D, for 4 weeks vs. using an oral steroid such as winsitrol?
I ask this because from everything I've read about an oral alone cycle, most gains aren't kept from it. If this is true with an oral alone steroid, would a pro-hormone be any different? Or would it be worth while to stack an oral such as winsitrol with a pro-hormone like methyl-D??

Bottom line question: Would there be any benefit of me taking methyl-D for 4 weeks while I'm off, or would it be better to wait for my next cycle?

[joe bigboy]

PH's didn't do anything for me the few times i used em, some ppl say they worked but not for me

[shiko24]

thanks joe bigboy

anyone else ?

[Skyefire]

Re: pro-hormones vs oral steroids ?

Originally posted by shiko24
Stats: 28y/o, 5'9", 205lbs, 11%bf. Training for 10 years. Currently off cycle.
My question is, would it be worth using a pro-hormone, such as methyl-D, for 4 weeks vs. using an oral steroid such as winsitrol?
I ask this because from everything I've read about an oral alone cycle, most gains aren't kept from it. If this is true with an oral alone steroid, would a pro-hormone be any different? Or would it be worth while to stack an oral such as winsitrol with a pro-hormone like methyl-D??

Bottom line question: Would there be any benefit of me taking methyl-D for 4 weeks while I'm off, or would it be better to wait for my next cycle?

1-test is the only really efective ph advalble. M1T cycles will give you good keepable gains and is an oral only. Even then most people pin something with it like 4ADcyp or the like.

here is part of a FAQ I am woriking on. this part covers this question about orals.

Oral only cycles

Not keeping any of your gains on an oral only cycle is popular and common belief. This is not without reason. Many people don't keep their gains, not because of the type of drugs used or differences in potency but because of the type of people that use an oral only cycle. To make a success out of an oral only cycle you a. dedicated b. to be knowledgeable, c. disciplined. Most people (not all) that are all three don't tend to do the oral only cycles. They know that there are better options available and are going to use the safer, more effective methods to meet there goals. That usually involves other delivery types, specifically injections. So the irony here is that the very people that can make the most out of an oral only cycle don't use them while oral only cycles are the first cycles that the rest of the people tend to look at. They are the ones that don't want to inject, or rub themselves with smelly gels, or jest generally not willing to do what it takes. Newbies that are dedicated generally get talked into doing better things (or just learn). It really isn't to be wondered that people look down on orally only cycle.

However oral only cycles can be ran with success. And there are times when they are desirable. Anyone that has to travel should appreciate this. The key to success with them is four fold. First you must run a real full cycle. By that I mean you have to eat right, train right, get your sleep, and avoid taking shortcuts. In other words you need to be dedicated, the steroids are meant to help you along, not to be used as a crutch. Second is you cannot skip on your ancillaries, you need them to make this work right. This means using the appropriate anti estrogens, AI and/or SERMs. Third DO NOT SKIMP ON THE PCT. I don't know why but some people seam to think that they do not get shut down. Not true, PCT is as important as if you were running test. Fourth your supplements will make a big difference as well.

The following steroids are oral compounds that are designed (or will work regardless) to have oral availability. This usually done by two means; methylate the steroid to help prevent the liver from processing it or by using an ester that the body can absorb. The drawbacks to doing this are the methylated steroids all have some degree of liver toxicity and the esters suffer from low and/or uneven absorption. Also methylated steroids should never be used together if possible due to the liver toxicity. This obviously limits what you can do with oral steroids as most of the effective one are methylated.

Oxandrolone (Anavar, Var) Very safe but weak steroid. Methylated but surprisingly easy on the liver. Still it is liver toxic and should not be ran indefinitely. 8 weeks is as long as it should be ran. The main drawback to this steroid besides its strength is the cost. Anavar cost no more then Dianabol to manufacture yet cost sometimes as much as 20 times that of Dianabol. The reason for this is the US government got involved (are we surprised?) A law was passed that allowed companies to gain the equivalent of patents on drug that otherwise might not be worth their while if it was for AIDS. This coupled with the weak nature of the drug make it less then desirable for most.

Methandrostenolone (Dianabol, Dbol, Anabol) is covered in the common drug section. Probably the single best steroid if you are running an oral cycle. It is unfortunately also high in sides. Ancillary drugs are a must here. A Dianabol only cycle requires an AI and should also include nolvadex. Can be used for ether bulking or cutting. Bang for the buck this is it.

Oxymetholone (drol, A-bomb) is not recommend for first cycles (or at all by this author). Again the amount you need to run for an effective dose usually includes too many side affects. This is covered in the common drug section.

Stanozolol (winny, Winstrol) Same arguments as in the common drug section. On top of that it is mild steroid at best.

Trenbolone Acetate (tren, fina, finaplex H) This is a cattle implant (finaplex H) that contains the steroid Trenbolone Acetate. For more information on cattle pellets and such go to http://www.chemicalfitness.com/forum...read.php?t=127 for details. All that is important for this topic is the nature of the drug and that in come in convent pellets that you can treat like pill. Trenbolone is a powerful steroid, on of the most powerful available. It is almost always used as an injectable despite having a 25% oral availability. Given that Trenbolone is expensive this is not hard to understand. Additionally even accounting for the absorption it STILL works better when injected. Still even so it is still 2 to 3 times as powerful as testosterone. With that being the case it is usually not a drug to be used by the novice with orally being the exception due to the limited number of steroids available for oral use. Still expensive even as an injectable you’re stuck taking 4 to 5 times as much if taken orally. For instance to dose yourself 50mg of trenbolone a day you have to 200mg worth of pellets, that is10 pellets, divided at least twice a day, being 5 pellets twice a day. 75mg is better and I would prefer 90mg a day (oral isn't as effective as inject) but that can get really expensive (That is almost one cart every 5 days so about 8 carts at 32 dollars a cart 256 dollars vs. 5 carts being 160 dollars worth of pellets) if you can swing it that would be much better. But is still a waste of money compared to injecting. Still if your going to go oral this is high on the bang for buck. For the best collection of fina article (old though) go to http://www.rippedcanadians.ca/articles/fina.html

Methenolone acetate (Primobolan, primo) Another Acetate ester oral, this one has a better absorption rate some ware between 30 and 50%. So dosages start at 100mg a day preferable 200 and up to 300. A good steroid it is mild on the sides (notable it doesn’t do much to shut you down) with moderate gains you can take high doses if you wish with little on the sides. Did I mention you have to be rich to do this? One of the most expensive steroids on the market I have seen (literally) the tablets priced for more then twice what the whole tablet would weigh in gold. Recently some to the underground labs have been making these far more reasonable then that though. Still it is extremely expensive. It stacks well with anything and has the benefit of promoting you libido, useful if your using suppressive steroids. Additionally it stacks well with anything, with or replace testosterone (Trenbolone and Methenolone make for a awesome cutting stack). If you have the money then go ahead. For myself if I win the lottery my ass is going to the Bahamas.

Testosterone Undecanoate (Andriol) In a word this stuff is worthless. Designed to be an oral available testosterone (basically the body treats it like an oil so it bypass the liver) it just doesn’t work well. In some fashion most of the testosterone is destroyed requiring a starting dose of 240mg before you see even minimal results (doctors have prescribe HRT at 240mg a day). Worse the absorption rate changes day to day depending on what you eat, the time of day due to what your metabolism is like at the time and apparently the alignment of the stars. To add injury to insult the gel caps (the actual Androil tabs) are expensive. Even the doctors don’t like this stuff for HRT. Why they still make it I do not know.

For most oral only cycles the only thing I really recommend is Methandrostenolone. High bang for the buck and good results used alone it is one of the few drugs other then test that can be ran as a single drug cycle. Most everything else needs to have something stacked with it. Here is an example of a Methandrostenolone only cycle:

Here is a sample of a Dianabol dbol only cycle:
50mg Methandrostenolone ED (25mg twice a day) for weeks 1 to 6
.25 to .5 mg of Anastrozole ED for weeks 1 to 6
10mg of nolvadex ED for weeks 1 to 6
Start PCT week 7 with 40mg of nolvadex ED for two weeks then 20mg ED for another two weeks.

Here it is again with a minimal dose of fina. (360mg ED would be best)
50mg Methandrostenolone ED (25mg twice a day) for weeks 1 to 6
200mg Finaplex H pellets ED (5 pellets twice a day) for weeks 1 to 6
.25 to .5 mg of Anastrozole ED for weeks 1 to 6
10mg of nolvadex ED for weeks 1 to 6
Start PCT week 7 with 40mg of nolvadex ED for two weeks then 20mg ED for another two weeks.

[mastakillah]

if youve already crossed over to the "darkside" i dont think any prohormones would do anything for you!

[shiko24]

Originally posted by mastakillah
if youve already crossed over to the "darkside" i dont think any prohormones would do anything for you!

see thats what I was thinking but if it gives me a little edge while I am off with out shutting me down it might be worth it

[audiowaves252]

prohormones still shut you down bro

[beefcake]

Methyl Dien isn't a ph. It's an active steroid.

[shiko24]

Originally posted by beefcake
Methyl Dien isn't a ph. It's an active steroid.

then would it be worth taking ? or should I just wait till Jan 1 for my real cycle ?

[beefcake]

Originally posted by shiko24
then would it be worth taking ? or should I just wait till Jan 1 for my real cycle ?

The reviews and user feedback i've seen on md was pretty disapointing. There was a ton of hype when it first came out but then the results were poor. A lot thought it was due to incorrect dosage recommendations but who knows. Now that sledgehmr has updated the dosage recommendations, perhaps the results are now better. Don't expect quick mass though. It's more of a lean bulker.

[meatbldr]

Prohormones are bogus bro. Why don't you just take a cough drop and pretend it is D-bol.

[Golgo13]

I've tried many PH products... None of them did much, with the exception of M1T which is actually a steriod.

M1T gives me insane gains.

[audiowaves252]

Originally posted by Golgo13
I've tried many PH products... None of them did much, with the exception of M1T which is actually a steriod.

M1T gives me insane gains.

good to hear i just started a cycle of it at 20mgs/ed. what dose did you run it at?

[Pedro]

Nice faq your working on.
But dbol only cycles really shouldnt be done imo

[string_bean00]

M1T seems to give the most gains for being a legal substance.



500mg of testosterone for 10-12 weeks is still an awesome first cycle, though.