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LOL! I was waiting for YJ to see this and reply--who does this noobie think he is?!
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I dont mind a good debate as you BB and Puma make valid, interesting points and I respect that, but apparently some members dont have the balls to post with their real usernames and resort to acting like a fucking kid instead of debating as adults.. I apologize for taking this thread off topic....Comment
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I've seen some great debates on here but this was unreal... I was sooooooo waiting to see what you had to say to all of this B.S. from the new guy.Originally posted by YellowJacket
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"Ok, you have 2 posts, so wont you have some balls and post under your REAL board name... because youre a fucking idiot. Look around douche nozzle, supplements are being banned everyday."
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:Last edited by coffee-guy; 08-08-05, 09:24 PM.Comment
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And that would be the first thing I suggest. Just like you don't get a tit job done at the local bar, doctors should write for steroids. I do not favor a "free for all" but allow doctors (maybe plastic surgeons, its right up their alley) to start to write for steroids for physique enhancement.
I think we all know that steroids have side effects and can be very dangerous if used incorrectly. But so can just about every drug out there. M1T was a good example (although its now gone). This drug ripped your liver, but because it was over the counter lots of people took it, primarily because they COULD NOT GET SOMETHING ELSE! That's the point, people are not able to get the "known" substances as easily as these "supplements" that float around out there. Where do you think more studies have been done, M1T or testosterone. I can pretty much, without a doubt, assure you that its testosterone. But people were taking M1 like it was candy because they could get it. You think if they could get Test and dbol they would be messing with M1? Hell no; but because M1 was legal, people took it an basically experimented on themselves.
I do not argue for the "Mexico" system here where you just walk in a pharmacy and pick up whatever you want. I want there to be doctors who will write you for whatever you want provided you submit to regular tests to make sure your healthy. Honestly, I think the biggest thing is to make sure that the people who want it can get it, and to have someone giving it out that knows more then a Mexican "phamacist". Some of these drugs should NEVER be taken under any circumstances. And people use crazy quantaties of other drugs because they can't get the right things to stack together.
[QUOTE=YellowJacket]I think you are the one missing the point.... anabolic steroids are illegal. To say AAS have no significant side effects is comical. No matter how they are used there are always risks. There is, and never will be, a valid argument for the legalization of anabolic steroids. They simply do not have enough rewards to overshawdow the risk.
What risks do you speak of? Liver damage? Cancer? Death (cardiac failure/hypertension)? I think that these are all very reasonable concerns. However, take a look at the drugs they do sell OTC in this country. Tylenol, probably more toxic to your liver than A50. Ephedra, known to cause heart attacks. Pseudoepenephine (I know that's spelled wrong), a chemical hop skip and jump to Methamphetamine. How many deaths from Tylenol have we had as compared to deaths from steroids? I just don't believe that they are that dangerous, when used REASONABLY. That's why a doctor should be involved; helping you put together your doseages. If you think that doctors don't want a part of that, or will not lower themselves to "physique building" just watch Dr. 90210 and see the doctors help these women decide how much saline to put in their tits and how much botulism to shoot in their faces. Doctors are the right people to help with this, they just don't want to touch it with a 10' pole because of how deamonized steroids are in the media.
PumaComment
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haha.. I did not see this guy only had 2 posts (so is almost definately already a member under another name). Listen guys, this is the place where we debate, discuss, and sometimes argue about things we can't talk to anyone else about. I don't think that people should resort to "fake" usernames just to join a conversation that's conterversial. Shit, I get in heated conversations all the time on this board! Just don't make it personal and stick to the facts. Nobody get's pissed if you have valid points, don't sling mud, and have some fucking clue what your talking about.. :)
Puma
Originally posted by fog_hat1981Comment
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Ok, I typed a pretty stellar response, but my power just went off so it erased everything I typed and Im in no mood to re-type right now, so Ill get back to it.... but remember these few points...
1. Tylenol is a pain reliever, steroids are ergogenic aids, these cant be compared because they arent in the same category and have no relation.
2. You said ephedrine is known to cause heart attacks, this is a bit ironic and a contradiction that you quoted the very same media you originally slammed. I could argue with you to my grave on the relative safety of ephedrine, abstracts, data and Medline studies and all.
3. Try looking at these issues from an economical stand point, because this being a capitalistic country, thats all that matters. If you were to ban Tylenol think of the economic crash and the jobs lost, not to mention the revolt of the citizens.
4. If you did legalize AAS, why not legalize Xanax and 'script drugs? AAS makes one feel good about themselves, gives them a heightened since of well being and self-image, doesnt Xanax and Adderal, etc. do the same? If you ddi legalize AAS, why not lobby to legalize cocaine too? Whats next? Where does it end?Comment
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what do you think a tax is!!!! lol....that is government intervention 101...I will say it again as I have said it 100's of times on the board. People can do something about it but americans are happy to let "them" handle our country. its as if people think the govt is now separate from us. People need to influence the generation coming up that will be the politicians of the future...you won't change the geezers that are in charge now. But if more of you are really serious than vote libertarian in the next election on all levels of govt. from local, to state, to national.Originally posted by BBAddict
YJ how can you say this "I think you are the one missing the point.... anabolic steroids are illegal. To say AAS have no significant side effects is comical. No matter how they are used there are always risks. There is, and never will be, a valid argument for the legalization of anabolic steroids. They simply do not have enough rewards to overshawdow the risk. "
...you are trying to validate their illegality by the risks. If that was the case LIVING would be illegal. They were not made illegal because of their risks to the human body. If anyone thinks for one second that the govt cares about your health you are sadly mistaken. They are illegal because the influence of the IOC and sporting organizations. I don't think the powers that be knew how widespread anabolics were used outside of sports. we all know how ingnorant most of them are even now so think of how much they did not know when they made them Schedule III. THe govt has NO RIGHT to tell us to where our seatbelts, to not drink, to not smoke, or to not take steroids. WE let them take away those freedoms by being complacent. and soon that complacency is going to be the imprisonment of us all in our own country.Comment
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it doesn't end they should all be legal :idea:Originally posted by YellowJacketComment
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:3some:
That's the problem. They are controlled now because of the sports and because they have to "protect" the sanctitiy of American sporting establishments. Which is just such total BS that it makes me sick (come on people, its a damn game, who really cares?!). But the thing is, if they stopped doing it, or did not do it, they are afraid they will not be able to keep us interested in pro sports.
What fun is it to watch the Olympics when your friend can run a 4 min mile all day long? Who cares who wins, their not the best anyway (they are just the best undrugged)? Or when your workout partner is bigger then a linebacker and faster too? Or when your brother can throw a 100MPH fastball, and your cousin can hit 500 yard home runs off of him all day?
I really think that the problem is they are afraid that we are all going to become better then the pro sports players, and pro sports are going to take on a "vintage" feel. People will still watch, but not really care. Also, the other problem is the way the "pros" would look as compared to other people. They would really appear to us to be small and weak, when compared to the people in the crowd who are all juiced up. Here is the thing they are not realizing, most of us don't give a shit about playing/being a pro athelete!! I am not practicing my hitting after the gym, although I am sure if I got ahold of a fastball it would be in trouble! I don't care, and I don't think that most other people do either.
This is fixable though, it really is! Keep your testing in sports. Keep steroids Schedule III or II. I don't really care. Just allow doctors to write for them for body enhancment! That's all we really want; shit I would love to have a doc (who has a clue) helping me put toghether my cycles and watching my progress for problems. And I think that most people who are serious about the sport feel the same way. People need to realize, even with all the juice in the world, most people STILL are not going to try to become bodybuilders. I would hazard a guess that most people still will not even workout (because its probably STILL too much work for these lazy fucks). But, if I was a trainer, and juice was legal, I could realistically tell everyone who walks into the gym (who is healthy) that they can put on 20lbs of muscle in the first 3 months, and that people will NOTICE that change, I think we would have far more people trying to take care of themselves.
Right now, its just too hard. People ask me all the time what my routine looks like and I go right to my diet. They look at me like I have 2 heads, and say something like "How long can you keep that up" or "When can you eat normally again"? Then I tell them I spend 5 days a week in the gym, for about an hour a day. And I can see what is going on in all their minds, that there has to be an easier, softer way. But you know what I am not telling them? Even if you go to the gym and diet correctly, your STILL not going to look like me! Because I take steroids, and quite honestly, without them people will have a difficult time telling if you workout at all. Come on, it takes a very rare breed of person to say "Fuck it, I am going to stop eating everything I like, give up hours of every day, and break the law, risking my freedom, to look better and feel better about myself". Its much easier to just go home, have a beer, call me a juicehead, and forget about it. Which, is frankly, probably what most people do.
Its sad. But the real thing is, ITS KILLING PEOPLE. Obesity is running out of control. And I think a primary cause is because people just can't stomach the idea of going to the gym 5X a week/being on a strict diet for the rest of their lives just to look average! Shit, I would lose it if I knew I had to do that!! People are dying here everyday, and that is a statistic I can really show you (they know people are dying from being fat; whereas steroids there are other causal factors, typically). If just 10% of those fat people (which comprises about 60-70% of the American public) would get in shape if offered the help of steroids, how many lives would be saved? How many lives would be lost to steroid deaths? That's the thing that needs to be addressed; our drug policy is killing people here. To draw an analogy, imagine if there was a blood pressure medicine that also got people high/made them feel good. If this was the only medicine that would control BP, and the goverment made it illegal because "kids were taking it to get high" we could very easily see how many people were killed everyday because of this policy. That's exactly what is happening right now. People are dying because they can't get the fat off of them. They can't get the fat off because they can't build the muscle, and just don't have the drive to do it. But a few of these people, if offered the chance, have the drive to do it if you give them a faster/easier way. Those are the people that could be saved.
It makes me laugh that if you go to the doctor and are overweight he can give you a script for speed (Dexadrine), but if you go and want to look better he can't write you for Test (or anything else). Sad.
Originally posted by stonecold54Comment
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Originally posted by stonecold54
Yes I am.... thats why things are illegal in this country. Its illegal to go 90mph on the interstate here, thats an unnecessary risk, its illegal to base jump here, its illegal to ow nand operate a meth. lab. Why do you think a lot of things in this country are illegal? Suicide is illegal.
If you honestly thing steroids are illegal due ot their involvement in AAS, youre sadly mistaken. If people here would think outside of sports for a minute and look at the big, broad picture, you would understand.
Again, steroids, tobacco and alcohol cant be bunched into the same category. I know this is a anabolic board and a lot of you guys are AAS users, but that certainly doesnt justify placing anabolic steroids, a recreational drug, into the same category as alcohol and tobacco.
I am very thankful AAS are illegal and Im even more thankful to know they will remain that way for my lifetime and my kids lifetime as well.Comment
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Originally posted by Puma
Obesity and being overweight in general is a health risk and can cause serious complications.... not being able to bench 350lbs and pick up girls at the beach isnt a health risk.Comment
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I guess we differ in general philosophies because I am saying that as long as you are not encroaching into some ELSES freedom you have the right to do anything with your body or put anything into it. so in that sense I can lump all drugs together as they are all a personal choice. I am just arguing on a more broad topic.Originally posted by YellowJacketComment
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Hey, you know our government, theyre just looking out for oyu and doing what they can to keep you safe :)Comment
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stonecold
.THe govt has NO RIGHT to tell us to where our seatbelts, to not drink, to not smoke, or to not take steroids.
Smoking increases the risk of cancer. More cancer raises insurance premiums by incurring health costs.
The government financially backs up big insurance companies and government money comes mostly from tax dollars (you and I).
This equates to society paying for a smoker's health costs from smoking a cigarette. The same logic can be applied to many illegal or regulated products.
If something is damaging to an individual, often enough it's directly or indirectly damaging to society. I'm sure this reasoning works for alcohol's and steroids' health risks.Comment
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This is an oxymoron - the government wants to limit smoking to scale back insurance premiums and tax dollars however they support (or at least enable) the tobacco industry and allow obesity to engorge society...Originally posted by ill doodComment
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