Remind Me To Cancel My Hunting Trip To Wisconsin

[Scrumhalf]

Originally posted by monkeygirl
Thank you, Scrumhalf, for that link. I am embarrassed to admit that I had no idea about the Hmong at all before reading that. How sad that people feel the need to lash out at others for being different, as our country is supposed be a 'melting pot' where anyone can make a home.
Of course, if this man did indeed just start shooting at the other hunters, he does deserve to be brought to justice. That justice should be delivered due to his actions, not his heritage.
Most serial killers are white men, but not all white males are serial killers, and not all Hmong go out and massacre hunting parties.

You are welcome - happy to oblige. It is very important for us as Americans to understand how our actions (and really those of a lot of other western nations) in countries far away can have permanent or long-lasting impact on peoples and cultures.

Also, let's not jump to conclusions about the hunter in question. News reports today indicate that he insists the others shot first and racially abused him. While two wrongs do not make a right and I don't know the veracity of his statements, the fact that so many of us on this thread have decided to act as judge, jury and executioner to declare him unworthy of living, and his race as unworthy of being in this country reveal more about ourselves than we would like.

[Scrumhalf]

For some who question why "they let all these foreigners in here," here is an exerpt from Jeff Lindsay's web page that I listed earlier:


While serving in special guerrilla units during the Vietnam War, between 10,000 and 20,000 Hmong men, women and children were killed, and more than 100,000 fled to Thai refugee camps.
There are 27,000 Hmong in Minnesota, and an estimated 5,000 to 7,000 of them fought in the CIA's special forces....


I submit that a lot of the Hmong have done more to earn the right to be Americans than a lot of us who have merely had the good fortune of being born on American soil....

[Puddles]

Originally posted by Keiser
Also i've never seen an asian deer hunter.

I have!

Well...kinda...I keep picturing Sana (she goes hunting just to torture Bouncer) in some hot little cammi shorts and boots with a rifle (nothing else, just the shorts and boots). Damn...this visual is making me all tingly in just the right places. ;)

[monkeygirl]

Originally posted by Scrumhalf
You are welcome - happy to oblige. It is very important for us as Americans to understand how our actions (and really those of a lot of other western nations) in countries far away can have permanent or long-lasting impact on peoples and cultures.

Also, let's not jump to conclusions about the hunter in question. News reports today indicate that he insists the others shot first and racially abused him. While two wrongs do not make a right and I don't know the veracity of his statements, the fact that so many of us on this thread have decided to act as judge, jury and executioner to declare him unworthy of living, and his race as unworthy of being in this country reveal more about ourselves than we would like.

I just want to clarify that I am not jumping to conclusions about Vang. I am also trying not to jump to conclusions about what may have triggered his reaction- although my immediate reaction is to wonder what scared him enough to make him open fire. So far, I think it a tragic situation with horrible results for all involved, and I will try to leave it at that until there is a trial.

I am however, appalled at deputy Tim Zeigle who said Vang was "chasing after them and killing them," and "he hunted them down," and sheriff Jim Meier who said, "The suspect got down from the deer stand, walked 40 yards, fiddled with his rifle. He took the scope off his rifle, he turned and he opened fire on the group," (www.cnn.com).
These men are out there speaking to the reporters about a case that hasn't been investigated, further tainting a media that doesn't need any help with misinformation. Not to mention the effect those statements may have on the community. This is totally irresponsible behavior by these men, and by the media.
Well, that's it for my rant about how much the media sucks!

[billy59]

I think I may be the only Hmong in this forum. Let me first start off by introducing myself. I'm Billy, 24 yrs old, and borned in Thailand. My dad was a soldier with the CIA during the Vietnam war. After the war was over, we had to come to the United States because we wanted to escape communism. After living here practically my whole life, I gained a strong interest in bodybuilding/powerlifting as I grew up. I joined not to long ago but I haven't posted yet because I've been busy with school and work. I was going to post my pictures but now I'm having second thoughts. I was just browsing through the different topics to see all the interesting things that this forum had to offer but I never expected to stumble upon this one.

When I first heard about this news, I too was appalled by what happened. The only thing I've been hearing from the Hmong community is how much shame this guy has brought to the Hmong people. As soon as this happened, I knew that there were going to be people who would stereotype. I even told my friend that he should quit hunting for a while.

I felt that some of the things the Hmong hunter did was wrong and he should be justified for it, but there's always two sides to a story and I don't know the whole story so I'm not going to make any conclusions. I'm not trying to defend the Hmong guy either. Being Hmong, I just wanted to give my opinion on the issue to show how I felt about it and that not all Hmongs are like that. I understand that this is not a perfect world and racism will probably always exist, but if we all try then maybe someday, our younger generations won't have to deal with it.

Oh, and I would like to thank those of you who were more open minded regarding this issue especially monkeygirl and scrumhalf.

My prays goes out to the families of those who lost their lives in this tragic incident.

[Scrumhalf]

Welcome to the forum brother... may our future interactions be on happier topics!

[monkeygirl]

Originally posted by billy59
I think I may be the only Hmong in this forum. Let me first start off by introducing myself. I'm Billy, 24 yrs old, and borned in Thailand. My dad was a soldier with the CIA during the Vietnam war. After the war was over, we had to come to the United States because we wanted to escape communism. After living here practically my whole life, I gained a strong interest in bodybuilding/powerlifting as I grew up. I joined not to long ago but I haven't posted yet because I've been busy with school and work. I was going to post my pictures but now I'm having second thoughts. I was just browsing through the different topics to see all the interesting things that this forum had to offer but I never expected to stumble upon this one.

When I first heard about this news, I too was appalled by what happened. The only thing I've been hearing from the Hmong community is how much shame this guy has brought to the Hmong people. As soon as this happened, I knew that there were going to be people who would stereotype. I even told my friend that he should quit hunting for a while.

I felt that some of the things the Hmong hunter did was wrong and he should be justified for it, but there's always two sides to a story and I don't know the whole story so I'm not going to make any conclusions. I'm not trying to defend the Hmong guy either. Being Hmong, I just wanted to give my opinion on the issue to show how I felt about it and that not all Hmongs are like that. I understand that this is not a perfect world and racism will probably always exist, but if we all try then maybe someday, our younger generations won't have to deal with it.

Oh, and I would like to thank those of you who were more open minded regarding this issue especially monkeygirl and scrumhalf.

My prays goes out to the families of those who lost their lives in this tragic incident.

Welcome, Billy! That was a great post- thank you for sharing with us. I hope that you will post more as school winds down, and I hope that you find the same warm welcome that I did!

It would be great if you posted your pics- people here are really supportive when it comes to pictures.

As far as Vang goes, it is really unfortunate that it has now come down to his word against the hunters' word. This is the kind of situation where I don't think we can ever really know what happened out there.

[spidey]

I don't claim to have all the facts but the ones I do have are so far undisputed:

One of the hunters exited the cabin and saw Vang in the stand. We don't know what was said or how he was asked to leave. Vang shot this guy who called to the others on a radio. The others ran out to help but mostly without their rifles (curious). There was only one rifle in the group of 15 hunters when Vang opened fire and at least 4 of the eight people shot were shot in the back as the tried to flee.

Now, the circumstantial evidence is heavily against Vang with half the casualties being shot in the back, it is unlikely they posed a threat to Vang when he shot them. Even if (and I stress IF) the first guy fired first, all the others were unarmed and there was no need to shoot them too. Unless, of course, he was trying to eliminate witnesses. It should be pretty cut and dried when it goes to court. If the hunter's rifle was examined at the scene, it would have shown whether it had been fired or not. If not, that would mean no one fired at Vang before he went postal and this becomes a clear cut case of mass murder. If a rifle does show it was fired (maybe even having an empty cartridge still in the chamber), that would be pretty convincing evidence that a shot was fired at Vang but we still couldn't determine if the shot was fired before or after Vang opened fire. Again, even if it is determined that one hunter fired first, Vang still has to answer why he shot 7 more unarmed people including a woman and a father and son. Either way, he is guilty of murder.

[house1]

http://graphics.jsonline.com/graphic...304edits01.pdf


copy of the police report

[sana]

i hadn't even really read this thread b/c i'd already heard the story.

i'm horrified that race even comes into play in this thread. to those who think that foreigners should not be allowed to "walk all over this country" please, think about what made the US.

we are a nation of foreigners who have immigrated to this country. if you are uncomfortable with the non-anglosaxon make-up of the immigrants nowadays, you a unfortunately - a racist.

as a chinese american immigrant who moved to the states when i was 8, i take offense to any insinuation that immigrants are the downfall of this country and society.

i feel for the family who was massacred by this man, but he was a nut - regardless of his race.

to billy who feels this forum may be closed minded - i'm sorry that this was the first thread you've felt you've had to post on because you've had to defend yourself. this is not the atmosphere we want to foster here.

[spidey]

After reading the police report, it appears the only thing I had wrong was that the first victim called the others on the radio BEFORE he was shot, which explains why the others showed up unarmed.

IMO, the victims' stories are more believable. Why would you inform someone the police are coming and then try to shoot them when they were already leaving; it doesn't make sense.

Also, Vang admitted in the police report that he chased down and shot at least two people who he knew to be unarmed and therefore no threat. He also verified that the only person with a weapon initially was the first guy who told him to leave. He shot 7 unarmed people who were no threat to him and in many cases were running away. He should definitely pay; I hope they fry his ass.

BTW, race has absolutely nothing to do with any of this. This is a case of one nutbag committing mass murder and it doesn't matter if he was asian, white, black, or purple with green polka dots. He has to pay.

[house1]

we are a nation of foreigners who have immigrated to this country

agreed --

what i have a problem with is the mass amounts of illegals coming into this country-

i can list a million reasons why but as stated this should not have been about race-

so i will leave it at that