question on terri schiavo

[bonebreaker]

They ought to pull the plug on her parents, Jeb Bush and George Bush, and any other nut who can't see the light. I'm a parent and if my kids ever were to that point, I would gladly pull the plug myself, no check that, I would probably find a quicker way. Same for me, I don't want to be that way, let me check out with as much dignity as possible. THERE'S nobody home!!! Get over it and move on. AND GET A LIVING WILL FOR CHRIST'S SAKE. BB

[blm]

Originally posted by bonebreaker
They ought to pull the plug on her parents, Jeb Bush and George Bush, and any other nut who can't see the light.

Bottom line is that the government should have nothing to do with this.

[Face]

Originally posted by Kayak Jones
Don't quote the circling the drain process to me good bro. I've been in the field as a paramedic for almost 25 years now so I know the drill i'm sure far better than you and am not speaking out of my ass as some will on this subject.

Facts are facts and the fact is that you have no idea what she does or doesn,t feel.

Fact: Effects of ESRD can be terribly painfull as will almost anyone suffering from it will attest.

Fact: Although theoretically possible for the "feelings of hunger" as you put it to disappear in ketosis , the physical effects of dehydration are most unpleasant. Excruciating as described by many accounts, for at least some period of time.

Fact: Cardiac arrhythmias resulting in any degree of infarct are routinely and extremely painfull, to the extent that one of the primary functions of emergency cardiac care is to stop the pain and resulting tissue death.

Fact: The solution she was receiving through her g-tube was a standard high carb, nutrient solution. It is therfore highly unlikely that she was in any more of a ketonic state at any given time than you are I might be, unless we had intentionally caused it through a drastically reduced carb intake.

As far as this being a peacefull way to die, that would be a major subjective assumption on anyones part.

All very true, but Spidey still has a point in that she doesn't have a cortex; hence no sensory cortex and hence no sensation. Without sensation, she cannot feel pain.

[Kayak Jones]

There have been conflicting statements made by the physicians on both side of this case about the actual amount of cortex remaining. Not surprising, but only one side can be correct. I am just not sure which one it is and if they are gonna starve the poor thing to death on purpose, I sure wish they would get their shit together.

[Primal Instinct]

I'd think that her kidneys will probably fail soon and she'll be poisoned from it before she actually starves to death.

[bad14u]

Originally posted by blm
Bottom line is that the government should have nothing to do with this.

:agree:

[lxorl]

wasting millions of dollars for nothing!!!

[spidey]

Originally posted by Kayak Jones
There have been conflicting statements made by the physicians on both side of this case about the actual amount of cortex remaining. Not surprising, but only one side can be correct. I am just not sure which one it is and if they are gonna starve the poor thing to death on purpose, I sure wish they would get their shit together.

I haven't heard and conflicting reports on that at all. CAT scans and especially MRI are pretty detailed and accurate. If an MRI showed the cortex had been replaced by cerebral spinal fluid, that is conclusive. It certainly won't grow back.

Also, take into account the doctors who are siding with the parents. Most of them have not even examined Terri Shiavo and the few that have are affiliated with Christian Right-To-Life movements. Their oppinions are hardly unbiased. They have an ideological interest in diagnosing her as not in a PVS.

Put that up against dozens of the best neurologists in the world who have actually examined her and spent literally hundreds of hours observing her and have all concluded she is in PVS.

[Puddles]

I think the parents are being selfish. Their daughter has no quality life. Keeping her alive artificially is painful for her husband and children, they deserve some finality to the loss of this woman. The husband has done all he can do to try to give her a chance to recover years ago but since that can't happen, why keep her alive like this? She has no joy, her family has no joy, it's time to let her go.

I would not want my family to suffer emotionally and financially if I was in a similar situation. With no hope of recovery, end it quickly in a dignified way, do not drag it out.

[johnstephenson]

Okay guy's this makes no f@#$ing sense, There's a farmer in southern alberta whom couldnt afford to feed his cattle because of the border closing (no money coming in) so his cattle were starving. anyways he was charged with cruelty to animals and fined 50,000 bucks and lost all his cattle and his farm because of the fine...so why can a person be charged for somthing he has no controll over but yet they can starve this women (a human). I dont know anyone who was starved to DEATH and lived to tell how much it hurt. Even if she was hurting how is she supposed to say anything. And I dont belive the whole thing with her friend saying "she said she would never want to live like this" because what if the friend just doesnt believe a person should live like this....its all word of mouth. oh well everyone has there own opinion, but I will tell you one thing, I dont give a flying f@#k if my daughter got married, she is still my baby and no one is going to make a life or death decision on my baby's life but her mother and I.

[lookin 4 juice]

Originally posted by johnstephenson
Okay guy's this makes no f@#$ing sense, There's a farmer in southern alberta whom couldnt afford to feed his cattle because of the border closing (no money coming in) so his cattle were starving. anyways he was charged with cruelty to animals and fined 50,000 bucks and lost all his cattle and his farm because of the fine...so why can a person be charged for somthing he has no controll over but yet they can starve this women (a human). I dont know anyone who was starved to DEATH and lived to tell how much it hurt. Even if she was hurting how is she supposed to say anything. And I dont belive the whole thing with her friend saying "she said she would never want to live like this" because what if the friend just doesnt believe a person should live like this....its all word of mouth. oh well everyone has there own opinion, but I will tell you one thing, I dont give a flying f@#k if my daughter got married, she is still my baby and no one is going to make a life or death decision on my baby's life but her mother and I.

:agree: I agree..... the world has so many rediculous double standards.

[TheStromba]

http://www.terrisfight.net/


Look at the video "open your eyes"

[rude]

Originally posted by TheStromba
http://www.terrisfight.net/


Look at the video "open your eyes"

Hopefully all the doctors and experts on this board will see that :rolleyes:

I think the parents should be able to make the decision on her life. I think its very cruel on how she will die.

[imonboardtoo]

Credible Evidence: Doctors who treated her say she is brain dead. Therefore, she can't feel (emotions), enjoy, think, love...you get the picture. So, let her "live"? She ain't doin much living. On top of that, add the cost to keep her hospitalized and cared for, which could be huge for her husband/family/insurors. Nobody wants to talk about that, but it's an issue.

On the other hand, to withdraw food is as much killing (although our justice system differs with me) as shooting her in the head. It's just the timing that's different.

My opinion is that the husband should be able to decide because he is legally entitled to do so, and she gave him that right when she married him. But, I hate what he's doing.

[TheStromba]

Originally posted by imonboardtoo
Credible Evidence: Doctors who treated her say she is brain dead. Therefore, she can't feel (emotions), enjoy, think, love...you get the picture. So, let her "live"?

If you have not seen the video I posted above, watch it.

Either the doctors are wrong, or the video is a fraud. A women that is brain dead cannot open her eyes on command.

I am pretty conservative when it comes to how my taxes are spent, but I have NO problem with this.

Fuck giving Iraq, Saudis' Isreal money and aid -

Fuck paying for health care for illegal immigrants.

THIS is what tax dollars are really for, to care for and protect the most helpless in society.