Today in Biology class

[Bouncer]

good shit.

goes to show how creatures have adapted to their environment over millions of years. that kind of thing doesn't happen over night. aka evolution...

[Shibby]

good shit.

goes to show how creatures have adapted to their environment over millions of years. that kind of thing doesn't happen over night. aka evolution...

Part of what's so fascinating about the book I'm reading so far is how we keep evolving to stay in the same place (Sisyphean struggle). The book is based off of this Red Queen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia and a couple examples given are:

Cars move through the congested streets of London no faster than horse=drawn carriages did a century ago.

Computers have no effect on productivity because peopl learn to complicate and repeat tasks that have been made easier.

Word Spy - revenge effect

A biological example was that Polar bears. At one time if a bear wasn't completely white it was hard to sneak up on seals. So seals were relatively fearless. Then the more dominant white bears prevailed since that gene survived the best and had no problem catching seals. Now that the bears are white the seals became nervous and timid making it hard for the white bears to sneak up on the seals again.

[Turbo3000]

Part of what's so fascinating about the book I'm reading so far is how we keep evolving to stay in the same place (Sisyphean struggle). The book is based off of this Red Queen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia and a couple examples given are:


A biological example was that Polar bears. At one time if a bear wasn't completely white it was hard to sneak up on seals. So seals were relatively fearless. Then the more dominant white bears prevailed since that gene survived the best and had no problem catching seals. Now that the bears are white the seals became nervous and timid making it hard for the white bears to sneak up on the seals again.

I don't know if I like the polar bear example. That example makes it seem like if the polar bear population experienced a bottleneck, and the frequency of the allele for a pure white coat was basically lost due to genetic drift, and a spotted coat became dominant (with a higher allelic frequency in the population, making most of the coats spotted), that the seals would be fearless when spotting this new spotted coat bear, and I don't think that would be the case.

[blm]

I love this type of stuff.

Here is a neat one too.

YouTube - !!COCONUT-SHELL CARRYING OCTOPUS!!

[dna9488]

I love this type of stuff.

Here is a neat one too.

YouTube - !!COCONUT-SHELL CARRYING OCTOPUS!!

That is really cool.

[Shibby]

I don't know if I like the polar bear example. That example makes it seem like if the polar bear population experienced a bottleneck, and the frequency of the allele for a pure white coat was basically lost due to genetic drift, and a spotted coat became dominant (with a higher allelic frequency in the population, making most of the coats spotted), that the seals would be fearless when spotting this new spotted coat bear, and I don't think that would be the case.

I think you are missing the point of sexual selection, but yes, eventually the seals would become less skittish. To what degree would be the product of continued evolution.

[Turbo3000]

I think you are missing the point of sexual selection, but yes, eventually the seals would become less skittish. To what degree would be the product of continued evolution.

I don't see where sexual selection even belongs in this discussion. Are you referring to the fact that the female will pick a pure white male due to the thought of a higher fitness level? Then, after generations, the white coat will be in an extremely high frequency? I understand that part, and I agree with that, the example just sucks.

I liked every example you posted, the cars in London, the computer, etc..

I just don't like the polar bear example. A group of seals will not sit patiently on the ice while a big lumbering bear walks up, no matter the color, the polar bear usually doesn't feed in that manner anyway. A polar bear will sit at a break in the ice and wait for a seal to come up for air, and then snatch his ass.

[Bouncer]

i figured the polar bear was white so that he could blend in and hunt better in its native surroundings.

[Turbo3000]

i figured the polar bear was white so that he could blend in and hunt better in its native surroundings.

Yes, that among many other reasons.

[Shibby]

I think we are going in two different directions with the subject. The examples given weren't the same side of evolution. The computers and London cars are one type of evolution and the Polar Bear is another type of evolution. Both showing that as much as one thing evolves so does the world around it. Bringing the status quo right back to where we started.

[Turbo3000]

I think we are going in two different directions with the subject. The examples given weren't the same side of evolution. The computers and London cars are one type of evolution and the Polar Bear is another type of evolution. Both showing that as much as one thing evolves so does the world around it. Bringing the status quo right back to where we started.

Where did sexual selection fit in?

I see what you are saying, but trying to discuss this over the internet could lead to some confusion. I don't think I am explaining my point very well, some of it is getting lost in the typing.

[Shibby]

Where did sexual selection fit in?

I see what you are saying, but trying to discuss this over the internet could lead to some confusion. I don't think I am explaining my point very well, some of it is getting lost in the typing.

I get your point, I just couldn't figure out how it was related to what I was saying. Then I realized we were kind of going two different directions. Sexual selection has a lot to do with the book I'm reading. Evolution has a lot to do with selecting the best mate. What type of characteristics are best to survive and pass on those genes.

[Turbo3000]

I get your point, I just couldn't figure out how it was related to what I was saying. Then I realized we were kind of going two different directions. Sexual selection has a lot to do with the book I'm reading. Evolution has a lot to do with selecting the best mate. What type of characteristics are best to survive and pass on those genes.

Yes, Fitness.

[dna9488]

Hey Shibby, how's the book so far? Is there anything about the "Principle of Parsimony" in there?

[dna9488]

bump for Shibby. We talked about the Behavioral Ecology yesterday.