Serious Political Thread

[alwaysgrowing]

What is everyone's opinion on the current state of American politics?

I loathe the separation of Democrat v. Republican. Liberal v. Conservative. The definite labels seems to cause pernicious behavior on both sides. Rather than realize that every person has a different viewpoint (parallax theory for those aware of it can be modified to fit) which causes a different perspective.

The vitrol spewed by both sides does nothing to attenuate any problems we have. It seems rather than real dialogue on what is in the country's best interest, we tend to have people taking a position without backing it up with anything but false rhetoric. They then attack others views with a different scope than the original argument (damn straw man) There is a large difference between a position and an interest.

As for myself, I am neither liberal or conservative. I agree with both sides on different issues. My voting involves reading, research, analyzing and decision making. I do not follow a single party's line.

If possible, let us try to keep this threas civil. Basically, our disagreements should be logical evidence against a proposition rather than a personal attack using emotive language.

Deca and B, curious to your two views as being they seem to be diametric

[buell]

hang on whilst i get ma dictionary..dam big ass words got me all confrused. just kiddin and i see what u mean and i myself can expand and retract for the whats good but what sucks is the agenda that proceeds in most cases from the lowest to the highest is not for the people , but against the populace by those that control the agenda..

[alwaysgrowing]

I do agree that the ruling elite tend to make decisions that are often best for them. Marcus Aurelius said something along the lines of follow 2 rules:

1. Act only when logic says your action is for the best of humanity
2. Change your view when someone shows you it is wrong.

Many politicians work up the ladder, and then leave for lobbying work. Or they cut deals with companies to go work for them. It would seem that they are not working in government for the good of the people, but rather the good for themselves.

[buell]

I do agree that the ruling elite tend to make decisions that are often best for them. Marcus Aurelius said something along the lines of follow 2 rules:

1. Act only when logic says your action is for the best of humanity
2. Change your view when someone shows you it is wrong.

Many politicians work up the ladder, and then leave for lobbying work. Or they cut deals with companies to go work for them. It would seem that they are not working in government for the good of the people, but rather the good for themselves.

i love ya and u said.. rock on myfriend..

[buell]

I do agree that the ruling elite tend to make decisions that are often best for them. Marcus Aurelius said something along the lines of follow 2 rules:

1. Act only when logic says your action is for the best of humanity
2. Change your view when someone shows you it is wrong.

Many politicians work up the ladder, and then leave for lobbying work. Or they cut deals with companies to go work for them. It would seem that they are not working in government for the good of the people, but rather the good for themselves.

well said.

[Turbo3000]

I do agree that the ruling elite tend to make decisions that are often best for them. Marcus Aurelius said something along the lines of follow 2 rules:

1. Act only when logic says your action is for the best of humanity
2. Change your view when someone shows you it is wrong.

Many politicians work up the ladder, and then leave for lobbying work. Or they cut deals with companies to go work for them. It would seem that they are not working in government for the good of the people, but rather the good for themselves.

Exactly.

I agree with pretty much every thing you have written in this thread. The 2 party "system" is a huge problem. People don't understand that these people are doing this as a JOB (to become extremely wealthy and important), not as a service to our Nation.

Career politicians must END, unanswered spending must END, the Fed Reserve must END....just a few simple things to change that would really get us headed in a better direction.

[alwaysgrowing]

Exactly.

I agree with pretty much every thing you have written in this thread. The 2 party "system" is a huge problem. People don't understand that these people are doing this as a JOB (to become extremely wealthy and important), not as a service to our Nation.

Career politicians must END, unanswered spending must END, the Fed Reserve must END....just a few simple things to change that would really get us headed in a better direction.

Curious as to why you believe the Federal Reserve must end. I find that an interesting view.

[Shibby]

we tend to have people taking a position without backing it up with anything but false rhetoric. They then attack others views with a different scope than the original argument (damn straw man) There is a large difference between a position and an interest.

This part made reminded me of a scene from the Mentalist. :)

Between seconds 11 through 17

YouTube - The Mentalist Season 3: Episode 15 "Red Gold" Extended Official Promo

[Turbo3000]

Curious as to why you believe the Federal Reserve must end. I find that an interesting view.

In a nutshell,

Audit it at least, 7+Trillion has "disappeared" over the past few years, no one can find it.

They just keep spending, we keep working, and our money continues to depreciate.

[Shibby]

In a nutshell,

Audit it at least, 7+Trillion has "disappeared" over the past few years, no one can find it.

They just keep spending, we keep working, and our money continues to depreciate.

That is the stuff that irritates me to the point that all these discussions and trying to do something is pointless. How can stuff like that just happen? The media is all over it briefly, but the ones hiding it know that they just have to wait it out and the public will get bored with the topic. The people that have a loud voice that aren't politicians still don't use it and it's easy to ignore 100's of nameless people in the streets. Our govt almost needs to crash because it may be the only way to fix it. It appears to have reached a point where nothing will get better by trying to safely do it.

[alwaysgrowing]

In a nutshell,

Audit it at least, 7+Trillion has "disappeared" over the past few years, no one can find it.

They just keep spending, we keep working, and our money continues to depreciate.

Makes sense. From my understanding (correct me if I am wrong) the Federal Reserve has played a large part in allowing the economy to continue running during this crisis. As for it being inefficient, I am not surprised.

It goes back to money being the key. You have hedge fund managers whose income is taxed as capital gains rate, which is low compared to other billionares. I know they were trying to close the loophole, but not sure if they did.

I question how politicians can be objective and unbiased when voting on bills that involve special interest groups who donated their first born to the politico. For example, if an oil company has donated millions to my campaign, how could I justify to them voting for a bill that attacks their profits through either regulation or decreased tax breaks. A single no vote could cost millions.

I see that our system works, but there seems to be ways it could be run more efficiently. Otherwise you wouldn't have $50 billion Ponzi schemes run by wall streeters

[alwaysgrowing]

That is the stuff that irritates me to the point that all these discussions and trying to do something is pointless. How can stuff like that just happen? The media is all over it briefly, but the ones hiding it know that they just have to wait it out and the public will get bored with the topic. The people that have a loud voice that aren't politicians still don't use it and it's easy to ignore 100's of nameless people in the streets. Our govt almost needs to crash because it may be the only way to fix it. It appears to have reached a point where nothing will get better by trying to safely do it.

Our country has grown apathetic. But with our faces always buried in a screen, our children suffering strokes, and people being self-absorbed (I admit I am often guilty of two of the above) many don't care what the government does, as long as they are doing "ok"-- whatever that means.

People in general need to strive for more, but when we have so much as it is, what exactly is more may be a question that some people ask. Lack of a vision by the country could be the catalyst for this perspective.

[Shibby]

I see some of the main problems is that they only allow us to choice between their (politicians) choices. We only have two presidents on the ballet, for the most part. Why can't who ever wants to run be on the ballet just as much as the politicians favorites? The people who would do it for the right reasons and not the money, don't have the money to get elected. The people who have the money to get elected are only afraid of loosing their money. What happen to the days when govt work was about the work and not the money. There use to not be any money in govt work pretty much across the board. The only "career" politicians were the highest like 1%, the rest it was more of a second job.

One thing I really don't understand is why they can tax you so much on bonus pay within your job. They call it "unearned income". If I didn't earn it then why the hell am I getting it? All bonus are basically incentives to go above and beyond. So if you EARN a bonus then obviously it isn't "unearned income".

[Bouncer]

I don't really follow politics I am just opinionated when I hear something that doesn't make sense to me.

[alwaysgrowing]

I don't really follow politics I am just opinionated when I hear something that doesn't make sense to me.

From most of your posts that have to do with politic (or that which can be construed as political) you tend to lean left. Does not mean that you all your views are liberal, but you lean that way. But be opposed to something that does not make sense also make your a pragmatist