Moving over to AS

[GreekTank]

Originally posted by BENCH355ANIMAL
:agree: I gained 46 lbs. on my cycle of sustanon/tren, been off now for a month, and only lost 9lbs. My strength is still the same on all my lifts, and my sex drive never lapsed during pct. I believe Skyfire is who advised me to use the HCG in this method, and thanks to him for that!!

Thanks bro! so if my next cycle goes 12 weeks and the shots for TEST E are Monday & Friday what days should I shoot the HCG? and I take it you don't use it in pct just clomid & nolva, right?

[BENCH355ANIMAL]

Originally posted by GreekTank
Thanks bro! so if my next cycle goes 12 weeks and the shots for TEST E are Monday & Friday what days should I shoot the HCG? and I take it you don't use it in pct just clomid & nolva, right?

I would still shoot the HCG twice a week, whether it be Sunday-Wednesday or Mon-Thursday. You want to discontinue the HCG at least 1.5 weeks before you begin your clomid/nolva therapy.

[therock]

Hey bench you got pics? Cause 246lbs at your height should be massive!

[ROCKETW19]

Originally posted by BENCH355ANIMAL
As of this morning I weigh 246 lbs. @ 5'11", and a 34" waist. My cycle ended on February 5th. BF% comes up between 7.5 & 9% on my digital calipers, and I always add 3%, so I'm omewhere around 10.5-12% BF.

That fine ass in my picture is just some girl in the " I See Booty" thread. Nice huh.:hitit:

yea id say thats gettin big. im 6-1 238lbs and im startin to feel it, not sure if i wanna get up to 246. i probably couldnt run anymore.

[DiamondCutCows]

Originally posted by ROCKETW19
yea id say thats gettin big. im 6-1 238lbs and im startin to feel it, not sure if i wanna get up to 246. i probably couldnt run anymore.

Im 238ish at 5'9-10 and can still sprint well. Though now it is only 40yds. I used to be 4th best in MA at the 300:(

[GreekTank]

Originally posted by BENCH355ANIMAL
I would still shoot the HCG twice a week, whether it be Sunday-Wednesday or Mon-Thursday. You want to discontinue the HCG at least 1.5 weeks before you begin your clomid/nolva therapy.

Thanks!

[ROCKETW19]

Originally posted by DiamondCutCows
Im 238ish at 5'9-10 and can still sprint well. Though now it is only 40yds. I used to be 4th best in MA at the 300:(

whats a MA 300?

[therock]

Any of yall got pics cause all 3 of yall are heavy as hell. Shit I was 210lbs now I am at 193lbs as of today but I am cutting right now I am at 5'9.5''.

[BENCH355ANIMAL]

Originally posted by therock
Hey bench you got pics? Cause 246lbs at your height should be massive!

I'll snap one tonight and post it up for ya. I'm at work right now, and the only one I have of myself is a couple years old. I was only 195 then.

[GreekTank]

Originally posted by uridium245
Hey GreenTank,

I can't speak for Bench, but I can tell you that I used Swales HCG protocol on my last two cycles (250 iu twice a week). One was a 10 week cycle, the other 15 weeks. Using the good doctors (MD/HRT) protocol resulted in NO testicular shrinkage and the smoothest PCT imaginable. Zero changes in sex drive during PCT. I lost 2 lbs in the first week of PCT and gained 3 lbs in the following 3 weeks.

Swales idea is that if you keep the leydig cells stimulated it will take less time for the family jewels to return to normal. Here it is in his own words.

SWALE

I advise my AAS patients to use small amounts of HCG (250IU to 500IU) two days each week, right from the beginning of the cycle. This serves to maintain testicular form and function. It makes more sense to me to keep the horse in the barn, so to speak, then to have to chase it across three counties later on. I am also a big fan of maintaining estrogen within physiological ranges. Both therapies have been shown to hasten recovery.

Any more than 500IU of HCG per day causes too much aromatase activity. Some feel aromatase is actually toxic to the Leydig cells of the testes. You are then inducing primary hypogonadism (which is permanent) while treating steroid-induced secondary (hypogonadotrophic) hypogonadism (which is temporary--hopefully).

If 250IU or 500IU on two days each week isn?t enough to stave off testicular atrophy, then I recommend using it more days each week (as opposed to taking larger doses). In fact, I wouldn?t mind having a guy use 250IU per day ALL THROUGH the cycle. Those that have tell me they thus avoid that edgy, burned-out feeling they usually get. They also say they simply feel better each day. Subjective reports, to be sure, but they are hard not to appreciate. Especially when HCG is so inexpensive.

The testes are then ready, willing and able to again produce testosterone at the end of the cycle. LH levels rise fairly rapidly, but endogenous testosterone production is limited by lack of use. I also want to make sure a SERM, such as Clomid or Nolvadex, is at effective serum dosage (around 100mg QD for Clomid, 20-40mg QD for Nolvadex) when serum androgen levels drop to a concentration roughly equal to 200mg of testosterone per week. That is when androgenic inhibition at the HP no longer dominates over estrogenic antagonism with respect to inducing LH production. Of course, if the fellow has been doing Clomid or Nolvadex all along the way (and I now prefer Nolvadex over Clomid, due to the possibility of negative sides from the Clomid), he is all set to simply continue it at the end (no need to switch from one to the other). BTW, I see no evidence of any benefit in using BOTH SERM?s at the same time. I used to think a couple of weeks of the SERM was enough; now I like to see an entire month after the last shot of AAS (and migration of long to short esters as the cycle matures). Tapering the SERM is probably a good idea during the last week, as well.

I want my patients to stop taking HCG within a week after the end of the cycle. The testosterone production it induces will further inhibit recovery, as will using Androgel, or any other testosterone preparation, while in recovery. There is no escaping this, as there is no such thing as a ?bridge?. Just because you are not inhibiting the HPTA for the entire 24 hours does not mean you are not suppressing it at all. IOW, you can?t ?fool? the body?it is smarter than you are.

I like Arimidex during the cycle (in fact, consider use of an AI while taking aromatisables a necessity) but it ABSOLUTELY should not be used post cycle (even though it has been shown to increase LH production) because the risk of driving estrogen too low, and therefore further damaging an already compromised Lipid Profile, is too great (this also drives libido back into the ground?and we don?t want that, do we?).

All this is meant to get my guys through recovery as fast as possible (the real goal, yes?). So far, all of them who have tried it have reported they are recovering faster than when they have tried other methods.

"Green" tank? it's GREEK bro, first guy who called me green was that 6949 looser:rofl:

[therock]

Cool bench lets see it. Then when you get a chance post a recent one.

[BENCH355ANIMAL]

"Green" tank? it's GREEK bro, first guy who called me green was that 6949 looser

Uridium only has 7 posts bro.......6949 has been reincarnated:agree:

[Mick]

Some good reading in this post, all of the info is much appreciated. So glad I found this site. I've decided not to go with AS just yet and give myself another few month natural. I'm planning on squeezing another meal into the day, so I'll be eating seven meals in a day, one every two hours. Also going to replace my maximuscle Promax with Maximuscle cyclone, Promax only has 26g's of protein per serving with 1.86g's of carbs. Cyclone has 50g's of carbs and 63g's of protein with each serving (more expensive though, but, if you want the gains...). See what the next few months bring.

As said above, so glad I found this site, it's refreshing to see even users of AS guiding you away from them until you've reached your full potential through all other means. Quite motivating. It's a far cry from the people at the gym who say 'you should be on them asap' offering to get you some every time you go in, which gets really annoying sometimes.

Thanks everyone, especially the rock, your words of wisdom have inspired me to get over this plateu.

[BENCH355ANIMAL]

Originally posted by Mick
Some good reading in this post, all of the info is much appreciated. So glad I found this site. I've decided not to go with AS just yet and give myself another few month natural. I'm planning on squeezing another meal into the day, so I'll be eating seven meals in a day, one every two hours. Also going to replace my maximuscle Promax with Maximuscle cyclone, Promax only has 26g's of protein per serving with 1.86g's of carbs. Cyclone has 50g's of carbs and 63g's of protein with each serving (more expensive though, but, if you want the gains...). See what the next few months bring.

As said above, so glad I found this site, it's refreshing to see even users of AS guiding you away from them until you've reached your full potential through all other means. Quite motivating. It's a far cry from the people at the gym who say 'you should be on them asap' offering to get you some every time you go in, which gets really annoying sometimes.

Thanks everyone, especially the rock, your words of wisdom have inspired me to get over this plateu.

Awww.....Rock......you have touched him deeply :kiss: J/K Mick hehehehe

[therock]

Originally posted by Mick
Some good reading in this post, all of the info is much appreciated. So glad I found this site. I've decided not to go with AS just yet and give myself another few month natural. I'm planning on squeezing another meal into the day, so I'll be eating seven meals in a day, one every two hours. Also going to replace my maximuscle Promax with Maximuscle cyclone, Promax only has 26g's of protein per serving with 1.86g's of carbs. Cyclone has 50g's of carbs and 63g's of protein with each serving (more expensive though, but, if you want the gains...). See what the next few months bring.

As said above, so glad I found this site, it's refreshing to see even users of AS guiding you away from them until you've reached your full potential through all other means. Quite motivating. It's a far cry from the people at the gym who say 'you should be on them asap' offering to get you some every time you go in, which gets really annoying sometimes.

Thanks everyone, especially the rock, your words of wisdom have inspired me to get over this plateu.

That is very good to hear bro. Not that many people take our advice, but you did. That shows a lot of your character. Let us know how it goes and if you need help we are here.
BENCH, stop being:ghey: now where are those damn pics!!!!! J/K.