mein kampf

[bigbadexcursion]

Bush is my Boss. Seriously. He is the head honcho. I have a video of me meeting Dick Cheney on my Youtube, but G.W. Bush is my Commander in Chief. I may report to a First Sergeant but Bush is our boss. We do what he and Congress tell us to do.

On the to Hitler thing again it seems that people are in denial on these great accomplishments he made. There is nothing there. What good he did for his people? He made them live in a police state, he controlled the media, he killed millions of his own people just because and in the end he destroyed Europe. I'm pretty sure when it was all said and done the German people weren't thanking Hitler for his accomplishments. '

Hitler was a coward. He killed himself in the end, that says a lot about his character right there. He gave up on his people, and his so called caused and ended his life.

[Bouncer]

Bush is my Boss. Seriously. He is the head honcho. I have a video of me meeting Dick Cheney on my Youtube, but G.W. Bush is my Commander in Chief. I may report to a First Sergeant but Bush is our boss. We do what he and Congress tell us to do.

On the to Hitler thing again it seems that people are in denial on these great accomplishments he made. There is nothing there. What good he did for his people? He made them live in a police state, he controlled the media, he killed millions of his own people just because and in the end he destroyed Europe. I'm pretty sure when it was all said and done the German people weren't thanking Hitler for his accomplishments. '

Hitler was a coward. He killed himself in the end, that says a lot about his character right there. He gave up on his people, and his so called caused and ended his life.

i am not sure if you are unwilling or unable to see what i am saying. but i think i made it as clear as possible.. no offense.

[mindstar]

lets also address the issue of leading through fear. do you think hitler just started leading through fear one day? do you think he started yelling at people at the age of 19 and said, "follow me you fuckers"? he got to the position he did because people wanted to follow him, he was a born leader. sure, once he had enough power he started fear tactics but don't you think for one second that he didnt have millions of people that agreed with him and believed in him. hitler was a leader, he certanly was not a follower. this is not in dispute. what we are arguing is about the term "great". much like the time mag man of the year type argument. when i say "great leader" i do not mean a good person or a nice guy. personally, i think he is an absolute piece of shit. but a great leader none the less.

simple terms...
what made Alexander the Great, great was everything he accomplished on top of his military victories.

Leading through fear is not always about putting a gun to someone's head. It can also be convincing them that someone else may have a gun to their head. In fact, this is the most common type of leading through fear. Create a state where the population is terrified by some threat, real or imagined, and they will follow whomever says they can fix it. They will also be prepared to lose their humanity in doing so...such is the nature of fear.

I wonder what you mean exactly by great? You've alluded to it through admiration of military conquest, and public persuasion, but can you put it in a simple declarative statement or paragraph? I think I've done so in previous posts. That, I think is the basis for our disagreement.


On a side note, the Russian people recently voted Stalin 3rd in all time favourite Russian historical figures. Don't know that I'd call him great though.

[NYCmitch25]

BBE your brainwashed...lol. Bush is lowsey president. You have to be blind not to see that. The criticism is certainly warranted. Its pretty much common knowledge at this point that Cheney was running the country ... Bush is literally fucking stupid... on Air Force 1 they would sit him down and say "ok, heres is where Isreal is and this is why they are mad at us" ... just for the shear fact that he failed at public speaking. I believe its a big part of the job, he fumbled over his words all the time it was embarecing...

There are a lot of ppl with loser bosses.

[NYCmitch25]

I think most of you guys have difficult calling him a "great leader" because he caused so many atrocious; but there is no question he was fearless, charismatic, and had very strong leadership skills that won many victories for Germany. He used bluffing techniics to sieze countries along with the "blizkrieg" techniques and won many battles sometimes without even fighting. He assemblem one of the most talented (and ruthless) goups with Goering, Goebbels, Himmler, Bormann, and Speer. Again he was poor war strategist and often waffled, make poor descions such as invading Russia, not using Germanys secret weapons death ray, long range bombers, not utilizing women and he campaign against the Jews was uneccessary. He was a bad person but great leader.

[Bouncer]

simple terms...
what made Alexander the Great, great was everything he accomplished on top of his military victories.

Leading through fear is not always about putting a gun to someone's head. It can also be convincing them that someone else may have a gun to their head. In fact, this is the most common type of leading through fear. Create a state where the population is terrified by some threat, real or imagined, and they will follow whomever says they can fix it. They will also be prepared to lose their humanity in doing so...such is the nature of fear.

I wonder what you mean exactly by great? You've alluded to it through admiration of military conquest, and public persuasion, but can you put it in a simple declarative statement or paragraph? I think I've done so in previous posts. That, I think is the basis for our disagreement.


On a side note, the Russian people recently voted Stalin 3rd in all time favourite Russian historical figures. Don't know that I'd call him great though.

i understand your side and i respect it. i guess we just see greatness in a different way. i respect power no matter what tactic is used to get there. he lead millions and rivaled the super powers of the world.

on a side note, it is said that stalin may be responsible for more death then hitler was. ordered killings of untold millions in Siberia.

[bigscott]

I think most of you guys have difficult calling him a "great leader" because he caused so many atrocious; but there is no question he was fearless, charismatic, and had very strong leadership skills that won many victories for Germany. He used bluffing techniics to sieze countries along with the "blizkrieg" techniques and won many battles sometimes without even fighting. He assemblem one of the most talented (and ruthless) goups with Goering, Goebbels, Himmler, Bormann, and Speer. Again he was poor war strategist and often waffled, make poor descions such as invading Russia, not using Germanys secret weapons death ray, long range bombers, not utilizing women and he campaign against the Jews was uneccessary. He was a bad person but great leader.

thank you -- agreed !!

i will always look at hilter as one of the greatest - i like mao se tung aswell

they interest me - what made them tick etc etc etc - have read more and watched more things on the man they call hitler - starting to delve into more material on mao

bet most of you dont know the swastika is a good luck symbol that remains on many jewish synagoges today

[Turbo3000]

It can also be convincing them that someone else may have a gun to their head. In fact, this is the most common type of leading through fear. Create a state where the population is terrified by some threat, real or imagined, and they will follow whomever says they can fix it. They will also be prepared to lose their humanity in doing so...such is the nature of fear.

:idea::idea: Homeland security anyone......................................

[bigscott]

:idea::idea: Homeland security anyone......................................

ha ha ha ha good one turbo

[mindstar]

bet most of you dont know the swastika is a good luck symbol that remains on many jewish synagoges today

The swastika is not a good luck symbol, it's mirror image is.

[mindstar]

:idea::idea: Homeland security anyone......................................

It crossed my mind as I was writing. There is a great quotation by Goebles, Hitler's minister of propaganda which reads:

"Naturally the common people don't want war; neither in Russia, nor in England, nor in America, nor in Germany. That is understood. But after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. ...Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country." - Hermann Goering

It's true he understood the psyche of the public and used their fear to manipulate them...I still disagree with the term "great" though. I won't continue to beat a dead horse however.

I will admit that Hitler may be fascinating as a psychological case study, but to admire the man is, in my opinion, to abandon your humanity. You must take him in his totality and not attempt to isolate 'admirable traits' as that borders on making you an appologist.

[Mr I]

Having recently lost a job due to the company merging with a Jewish outfit, most of which coincidentaly kept their jobs I musn't let my emotions rise lol!!!

No seriousely no anti scemitism here.

Hitler can be compared to Idi Amin, Pol pot, Sadam, Mugabe in many respects;

1) All came to leadership when their countries were on their arse on way or another eitheir economic or civil unrest. This meant that people were in a desperate frame of mind and in this state tend to go for more extreeme personalities as leaders because they think an extreeme person is needed for extreem circumstances.

2) They were all extreeme, strong personalities but also without balance in their personalities and basically unhinged.

3) All brought an initial surge of unity to their general population which brings people back to work, increases confidence and gives the country a feeling of wellbeing initially.

Hitler did however have some resoned arguments but was alas ultimately a phsyco!

The gasing and genocide was called the final solution for a reason, because He'd asked Europe and the alies to take the unwanted Jews into their countries or help relocate them and didn't recieve the help as he saw it. So he resorted to killing them initially quietly.

Once the war was over what did the allied countries do? exactly as he'd asked, relocated many to Isreal, go figure!

I haven't read that book but ultimately I see Hitler as an intelligent, passionate, charismatic man, but a complete evil nutjob taboot

[bigbadexcursion]

Having recently lost a job due to the company merging with a Jewish outfit, most of which coincidentaly kept their jobs I musn't let my emotions rise lol!!!

No seriousely no anti scemitism here.


Hitler did however have some resoned arguments but was alas ultimately a phsyco!

The gasing and genocide was called the final solution for a reason, because He'd asked Europe and the alies to take the unwanted Jews into their countries or help relocate them and didn't recieve the help as he saw it. So he resorted to killing them initially quietly.

lol thats like right before someone says something racist but they forewarn you they aren't racist. it always makes me laugh. and its antisemitism fyi

unwanted Jews? again laughable. he wouldnt let them leave, but again what made the Jews not wanted? if we asked the world to get rid of the unwanted Mexicans or Italaians would that give us the right to gas them?

some peoples children ((rolls eyes))

[bigbadexcursion]

I will admit that Hitler may be fascinating as a psychological case study, but to admire the man is, in my opinion, to abandon your humanity. You must take him in his totality and not attempt to isolate 'admirable traits' as that borders on making you an appologist.

very well put.

[Bouncer]

very well put.

i don't admire hitler the person or his beliefs. i do admire his ability to rise to power.