Hey Art of War

[the art of war]

Suboxone is naloxone. I also look at the bottles everyday. :thumup:

lol weird, now i looked at an old bottle and sure enough you are correct sir - my mistake.

Hey Frank, buy him some milkthistle and get him chugging water - do a natural liver flush or something. All that APAP is making me sick thinking about.

[Turbo3000]

ya for real - imagine if he's taking down the 10mg hydro / 1 gram APAP :S

my liver cringes at that thought man fuck.

If he relapses after detoxing w subs , which he will. Tell him to google CWE - cold water extract , it'll save his life w his liver - also tell him to get to an NA meeting and get some help, he won't be able to handle this on his own unfortunately.

He can nip this in the ass now while he has a tiny habit and he'll have no idea how much he will owe you man - it gets so much worse when you start fucking around with real high doses of stronger opiates.

Vicodin ES has the highest acetominophen at 750mg. No 1 gram combo pill exists. They are slowly phasing out the 750,660,650, the will be long gone in a few years. Already getting docs to prescribe norco instead of lorcet, but the drug companies will fight back.

[the art of war]

I remember when I was 14 with the vics / percs there was one that was 1 gram I thought - maybe it was 750 - regardless I always stuck w the yellow watson perc 10s w 325mg :P

that was a long time ago , sorry if my memory is fuzzy , im sure you can understand why :P

[Turbo3000]

I remember when I was 14 with the vics / percs there was one that was 1 gram I thought - maybe it was 750 - regardless I always stuck w the yellow watson perc 10s w 325mg :P

that was a long time ago , sorry if my memory is fuzzy , im sure you can understand why :P

One may have existed. I was just talking about now.

[the art of war]

I gotcha.

Hey Frank - in all seriousness , the physical kick is the easiest part of addiction. People bitch and moan about it - but try living life after, that's when it gets hard. Anyone can make it 5 days , especially with the help of medication - but then life and responsibilities rear up their head. Re-learning how to feel (opiates are the ultimate at numbing anxiety / depression ) - these isues must be addressed or he will certainly relapse within days, if not hours.

If he doesn't have any support system (no offense to you, you are a good friend trying to help him, but what he needs in professional help and also ultimately the help of other addicts who have walked in his shoes and know what he is going through, are absolutely imperative in order for him to have a fighting chance at recovery.

Please tell him this and emphasize this is coming from a chronic relapser who has lost everything / been on as top of the world as I thought I could be / lost it all - 6 overdoses and some other things i cannot say cuz of legal isues. I started like him, with vics .. then percs ... then oxycontin / fentanyl / oxymorphine / hydromorphine .. and finally heroin - it happens FAST and addiction is a beast. While I'm staying clean today, my disease is in the parking lot doing pushups getting ready for that chance to jump in and fuck my life up / kill me. He needs help bro.

[FitnessBrat]

I gotcha.

Hey Frank - in all seriousness , the physical kick is the easiest part of addiction. People bitch and moan about it - but try living life after, that's when it gets hard. Anyone can make it 5 days , especially with the help of medication - but then life and responsibilities rear up their head. Re-learning how to feel (opiates are the ultimate at numbing anxiety / depression ) - these isues must be addressed or he will certainly relapse within days, if not hours.

If he doesn't have any support system (no offense to you, you are a good friend trying to help him, but what he needs in professional help and also ultimately the help of other addicts who have walked in his shoes and know what he is going through, are absolutely imperative in order for him to have a fighting chance at recovery.

Please tell him this and emphasize this is coming from a chronic relapser who has lost everything / been on as top of the world as I thought I could be / lost it all - 6 overdoses and some other things i cannot say cuz of legal isues. I started like him, with vics .. then percs ... then oxycontin / fentanyl / oxymorphine / hydromorphine .. and finally heroin - it happens FAST and addiction is a beast. While I'm staying clean today, my disease is in the parking lot doing pushups getting ready for that chance to jump in and fuck my life up / kill me. He needs help bro.

Great post, AOW. Good to see this attitude in you! :clapback:

[FrankTheTank55]

Yeah I know I can't help him kick this, I'm just trying to get him headed in the right direction. We've worked together the past 12 years. He was never into anything like this, hardly would even drink. His ex-wife (who also works with us) used to go out all the time! This wasn't his thing so she went out without him every weekend. Well she ended up having an affair and wanted a divorce. Could you imagine having your heart broken by someone then have to go to work everyday and see them?

To make things worse, when they were married they wanted a baby but could never get pregnant. They went though all these fertility clinics a d nothing worked. Well like a month after she moved out she ended up pregnant by this other guy. So now not only does he have to see her everyday, he sees her belly growing and everybody happy for her. I think he just wanted to stop feeling the pain and the pills did that for him. Then it just got outta hand.

Thanks for all the Info and advIce! I wIll pass It along to hIm and try to help hIm get some help. He is a good guy and I hate seeing him waste his life away.

[Bouncer]

good luck in helping him bro but dont get your hopes up. key words for me are "he wont get help". thats all i need to hear honestly. i say dont waste your fucken time.

[FrankTheTank55]

good luck in helping him bro but dont get your hopes up. key words for me are "he wont get help". thats all i need to hear honestly. i say dont waste your fucken time.

I hear ya Buddy!! I'll do anything for a frIend but I won't be made a fool out of or get myself stressed out about it. I'll offer my help and try to get him to wake up but if he doesn't want it then that's on him.

[the art of war]

The best help you can give him is to point him in the direction of professionals and NA / AA - an addict will understand an addict in any situation , I can relate to anyone in NA while my story is not everyones and vice versa - our problem is one of spiritual principles and I can go around a room and see all the character defects i work on alive and well in every addict ! The substance is the tip of the iceberg , it is what comes after that is the fight.

You are not an addict (thank God for that bro, for real) , you can easily go online and find a local guide for NA / AA meetings and from there they will take him under their wing as long as he simply says "Hi im so and so an addict im new and i just detoxed for the first time off vicodin I need help so I don't relapse" - that's all he needs to do bro.

[Bouncer]

plus frank, i hate to see you get in some sort of trouble if this guy fucks up and somehow someone finds out you were giving him drugs. we know your intentions but other people like his family etc.. may just view you as a person giving him drugs.

[FrankTheTank55]

plus frank, i hate to see you get in some sort of trouble if this guy fucks up and somehow someone finds out you were giving him drugs. we know your intentions but other people like his family etc.. may just view you as a person giving him drugs.

Yeah that's what kinda freaked me out earlier and made me even bring this up. Sometimes my heart acts a little faster than my brain...lol

[the art of war]

Yeah that's what kinda freaked me out earlier and made me even bring this up. Sometimes my heart acts a little faster than my brain...lol

You've already given him enough to make it through 4 days of withdrawals @ 2mg a day - his habit is tiny , he can make it np w that dose. No more buying narcotics / giving him anything at all - esp cash bro , he will quickly turn the table once you enable an addict.

If you want info on outpatient help and treatment i can send you links to your area bro. Lmk man, and all you can do is pray for your boy, chacnes are not good for him. But they aren't good for me and still won't ever give up man!

[FitnessBrat]

chacnes are not good for him. But they aren't good for me and still won't ever give up man!

Not a good attitude :disagree:

[the art of war]

How is that a bad attitude ? Statistically speaking my chances are not good , but that doesn't mean I will ever quit and throw the towel in - I want to kick those statistics ass, and I am doing just that at the moment. I don't understand your qualm with that statement FB :|