Trump Is President

[chuckz28]

The problem in this country that needs addressed is when a high school girl can get prescribed testosterone easier than an adult male...

[Bouncer]

But how is it really different? If I identify as a woman and you say I should be able to use the women's bathroom, why shouldn't I be able to compete against the people I identify with in sport?

See the problem here is about reality. They only "identify" with the other sex. That doesn't mean they are the other sex. If your brain cannot detect your actual physical form, by definition you have a mental illness.

That reality would become all to clear if you allow Usain Bolt to compete against top women sprinters simply because he "identifies" as a woman. He would annialate the competition.

All you are doing by allowing the bathroom option is indulging their mental illness and opening the flood gates to what's to come.

I have to say it. I think you are a hypocrite for saying the bathroom issue is fine yet the sport issue is not.

[Scrumhalf]

But how is it really different? If I identify as a woman and you say I should be able to use the women's bathroom, why shouldn't I be able to compete against the people I identify with in sport?

Because performing a necessary bodily function is not a sport? Really, I am not sure where you are going. Now using the bathroom is like a competitive sport?

[Bouncer]

Because performing a necessary bodily function is not a sport? Really, I am not sure where you are going. Now using the bathroom is like a competitive sport?

I know you're much smarter than that.

If you're willing to indulge their mental illness with the bathroom issue why not indulge them with the sports issue. Is that not discrimination by your own argument?

If I identify as a woman who are you to not allow me to compete against them!!??

[Scrumhalf]

I know you're much smarter than that.

If you're willing to indulge their mental illness with the bathroom issue why not indulge them with the sports issue. Is that not discrimination by your own argument?

If I identify as a woman who are you to not allow me to compete against them!!??

BECAUSE USING THE BATHROOM DOES NOT PREVENT THE OTHER WOMEN FROM GETTING MEDALS!!!!!

If you have concluded that I am "indulging their mental illness," I guess we don't have anything further to discuss.

[Bouncer]

BECAUSE USING THE BATHROOM DOES NOT PREVENT THE OTHER WOMEN FROM GETTING MEDALS!!!!!

If you have concluded that I am "indulging their mental illness," I guess we don't have anything further to discuss.

Indulge me one more time. I do like hearing your thoughts on matters we disagree so much about. 1 question, that's it.

If you are born with a brain that cannot identify with the physical body it's attached to, is that not a brain that is malfunctioning?

[Scrumhalf]

I don't think we know enough about the brain to understand why it behaves the way it does. But one thing has been pretty much established among the medical community - gender dysphoria is not a disorder or a mental illness.

The BIGGEST risk factor with gender dysphoria, the biggest set of symptoms that people have to deal with, is associated with stress. Stress of how they are treated, stress about using bathrooms in public, etc. That is why slowly things are moving towards where people can use bathrooms associated with their gender identity.

You keep focusing on the theoretical possibility that opening this door means that men will barge into women's restrooms willy nilly, cats will sleep with dogs, etc. But there is no evidence whatsoever that we have a cross-bathroom epidemic going on. So, I think it is fear mongering. I think most people realize the spirit of law and that for a burly bearded guy to enter the women's bathroom to make a point is just plain stupid, which is why it never happens.

[Bouncer]

I don't think we know enough about the brain to understand why it behaves the way it does. But one thing has been pretty much established among the medical community - gender dysphoria is not a disorder or a mental illness.

On the one hand you say we don't know enough about the brain. On the other hand you say its been established that its not any sort of disorder. This is a contradiction IMO. How can you be so sure of something you freely admit we don't fully understand?

I'm asking you to use common sense. A brain that does not identify with the body it's attached to must by definition be some kind of malfunction.

At the very least it's a brain that cannot interpret reality and I think that qualifies as a malfunction don't you?

[Bouncer]

Experts dispute Trump's assertion that U.S. nuclear arms capability is lagging | Reuters

[chuckz28]

"But there is no evidence whatsoever that we have a cross-bathroom epidemic going on."

Just because you chose not to see the bathroom problem doesn't mean it isn't there.

1. Man Dressed as Woman Arrested for Spying Into Mall Bathroom Stall, Police Say | NBC4 Washington

2. http://www.king5.com/news/man-womens...-rule/65533111

3. Palmdale man arrested for videotaping in women

4. Sexual predator jailed after claiming to be

5. University of Toronto Dumps Transgender Bathrooms After Peeping Incidents | Daily Wire

6. Man accused of filming women in Smyrna park’s bathroom | WKRN News 2

7. Fullerton man arrested on suspicion of filming people in a Chapman University bathroom - The Orange County Register

8. Campbell man, a teacher, arrested for secretly recording people inside bathroom – The Mercury News

9.
Teacher among 16 facing child porn charges in New Jersey | abc7chicago.com

10. Colfax man arrested for allegedly filming women in bathrooms - Spokane, North Idaho News & Weather KHQ.com

11. Man arrested after camera found in restaurant bathroom

12. Teen arrested in Perrysburg Jr. High Investigation - Toledo News Now, News, Weather, Sports, Toledo, OH

13. http://www.aol.com/article/2016/02/1...athr/21310769/

I've got about a dozen more of these.

[Scrumhalf]

Is even a single one of these because of the directive to allow transgender people to use the bathrooms that match their sexual identity?

I'm more than willing to engage in a rational conversation but you've got to meet me half way. Don't trot out a bunch of illegal behavior that has nothing to do with the transgender issue.

[Scrumhalf]

Again, the premise that I am hearing, and challenging, is that allowing transgender people to use the bathroom matching their sexual identity will cause an epidemic of sexual assault, rape, voyuerism, etc.

I'm simply not buying that premise. People have been engaging in illegal behavior before, and will engage in illegal behavior after. The notion that this illegal behavior will increase in leaps and bounds if the transgender rule goes in is simply fearmongering with no evidence to support it.

[Bouncer]

That's not what I'm arguing at all. I'm arguing the fact that you are indulging mental illness and/or brain malfunction by letting them in the bathroom they "identify" with in the first place.

[Scrumhalf]

That's not what I'm arguing at all. I'm arguing the fact that you are indulging mental illness and/or brain malfunction by letting them in the bathroom they "identify" with in the first place.

OK, I'll bite. What's the great harm? You know that transgender youth suffer from extreme stress, they have a significantly higher suicide rate, etc. Why not accommodate this relatively simple thing? There is plenty of evidence that trans youth would rather not use the bathroom all day than be forced to go to the bathroom that matches their birth. Are people really so insecure that they cannot accept this, when there is literally ZERO evidence that it can cause a public safety issue?

It seems like we would rather label them as having a mental condition or disorder or malfunction than to take simple steps that alleviates the real daily symptoms of their situation, which is an unhealthy level of stress.

[Bouncer]

OK, I'll bite. What's the great harm? You know that transgender youth suffer from extreme stress, they have a significantly higher suicide rate, etc. Why not accommodate this relatively simple thing? There is plenty of evidence that trans youth would rather not use the bathroom all day than be forced to go to the bathroom that matches their birth. Are people really so insecure that they cannot accept this, when there is literally ZERO evidence that it can cause a public safety issue?

Depression, stress, fear, anxiety, and suicide are not just problems faced in the transgender world. The way to solve these issues is not by saying "ehh what's the harm in giving that person with mental reality problems whatever he/she wants". All that does is legitimize their mental condition and make matters worse.

Obesity comes to mind as I'm trying to find ways to get my point across to you. We as a society have become so accepting and so mindful of anything that offends that we've created norms that just shouldn't be.

Fat people now walk around proud. They walk around in ever increasing numbers because our society caters to them and "feels" for them. If you dare make a suggestion that they could diet or exercise you are demonized.

Your solution to helping trans people by saying "what's the harm" is like telling fat people "it's what's inside that counts". It's bullshit designed to make people with a problem feel better. It does nothing at all to fix the actual issue.