Mini cut or mini bulk before Havoc cylce??

[NYCmitch25]

how'd it go?

[dynamite18]

Well before he started taking it he was always in the gym working out hard, and he eats good too.

[Bouncer]

The only reason I ask is because a guy from my gym stacked it and gained 20lbs. and after he got off he kept about 10lbs. I just wanted to see if anyone wlse out there heard of this stack.

did he gain 20lbs from the supplement or did he start training and eating better and gain 20lbs that way?

[dynamite18]

The only reason I ask is because a guy from my gym stacked it and gained 20lbs. and after he got off he kept about 10lbs. I just wanted to see if anyone wlse out there heard of this stack.

[Bouncer]

Has anyone heard if d-drol (by 4-ever fit) and winadrol by (cdt labs) is a good stack? If not what is?

generally speaking, any company that makes a supplement sound like the name of a steroid is garbage.

[dynamite18]

Has anyone heard if d-drol (by 4-ever fit) and winadrol by (cdt labs) is a good stack? If not what is?

[3v1lj03]

Researched a lot. Read hundreds of reviews and logs. Actually talked to some company reps too about specific products. Didnt actually order anything yet.

As far as my diet, training, and dedication... I'm far from half-assing it. Been very serious and dedicated for the last 2 years. But I admit, I would be lying if I said all that was perfect. I am however, skeptical as to how far I can go with genetics alone. Was never the most athletic kid and the men in my family arent exactly beasts.

I will however still natural for a bit longer, but I am also a realist. I will eventually, (and safely), take the next step.

The only sport I ever played was pee wee football and I was not good at it. I started weight training when I was 13 yrs old when I was a sophomore I read Arnold's book I was 5'6" weighed 150 lbs. I got some small understanding of nutrition and a different philosophy of BBing I graduated at 168 lbs at 5'7" and there was no fat. I wanted to weigh 172 lbs so bad I could taste it but I just could not make it happen all through my early 20s when I hit 25 my body finally started to respond to the training and the high protein I easily hit 185 lbs and it was much easier to build muscle and the strength was incredible people used to stop what they were doing to watch me move huge weight. I am not telling you this to toot my horn but to give you hope. There is no overnight success in BBing it takes years NO drug or supplement will put that time in for you. I have this quote from Jeff Willit on my desk and it helps me in those times when I don't think I am progressing:
"if you persevere and keep stringing great weeks of execution together, Who knows, in a few years you may be the next overnight success. "

BTW I have tried Havoc and Epstine (not sure spelling on that one) and they ain't all that.

[YellowJacket]

what do u consider it??

Designer steroid.

[The_Grinder]

Havoc = not a pro hormone.

what do u consider it??

[YellowJacket]

Havoc = not a pro hormone.

[The_Grinder]

I agree with these guys. i would take a hard look at your diet, training, and dedication.

Where did you get that stack from?

Researched a lot. Read hundreds of reviews and logs. Actually talked to some company reps too about specific products. Didnt actually order anything yet.

As far as my diet, training, and dedication... I'm far from half-assing it. Been very serious and dedicated for the last 2 years. But I admit, I would be lying if I said all that was perfect. I am however, skeptical as to how far I can go with genetics alone. Was never the most athletic kid and the men in my family arent exactly beasts.

I will however still natural for a bit longer, but I am also a realist. I will eventually, (and safely), take the next step.

[NYCmitch25]

I agree with these guys. i would take a hard look at your diet, training, and dedication.

Where did you get that stack from?

[Bouncer]

i just think you can do a lot before you go that route.

[The_Grinder]

good idea. i never thought very much of you trying the pro hormones anyway.

Well, as far as prohormones go, Havoc is pretty good stuff. Read dozens of great reviews. Great results and very few sides.

But like I said, I'll re-evaluate it after a few months. Maybe when I'm ready to go that route, I'll just go ahead and go with Test.

[Bouncer]

good idea. i never thought very much of you trying the pro hormones anyway.