strength vs. size

[plar135]

my friend and i were having and argument and i come to u for help.

he wants to gain size more than strength, and i care more about strength than size

now, what type of program would be better for his case, and what would be best for me?

for example, biceps:
his argument had to do with working bi's 3x a week (M W F) doing 3 sets a day, and stopping 2 or so reps to failure. this would increase the volume of work, but it wouldnt be as intense, and that this would give him more size gains than str gains.

i countered that the best thing for strength would be once a week, 1 or 2 sets of high intensity total failure bicep exercise, using drop sets, forced reps, etc. i dont know if this would give me good size gains, but i figure that it would help my strength.

which method is most effective for size? and which most effective for strength?

thanks

[Juka865]

idk too much about this but working biceps 3 times a week is retarded in my opinion. I work em as primarys on mondays with the tri's and shoulders then on fridays im workin em as secondarys with chest and back. that's all you need man. Not 3 times a week over working em will result in shit.

[plar135]

yes but are u working them to failure on mon and fri?

if u were to work them to fail 3x a week, yes i can see how that wouldnt be a good idea, but this is y wrote that u would stop at 2 or so reps before failure

maybe ur rite, but my argument sounds more like hst vs hit, and asking which is recommended for best size over strength, and vice versa.

[Aurora]

The 2 concepts are so intertwined it would be futile to try and distinguish them in your training.

[plar135]

intertwined? arent they opposites of each other?

[Shibby]

I think she means, more muscle = more strenght, and vice versa.

[plar135]

ok that makes sense, but more str doesnt always mean more muscle, and im trying to use a program that inc my str w.o. gaining so much mass, while he wants to gain a lot of mass and the strength that comes w. the extra muscle. i know its possible to get a lot stronger w.o. gaining lots of muscle, but i dont know the best program for that, and he doesnt know the best program for him, which is what we are discussing and cant figure out

[Shibby]

What your doing right now is just teaching your body to use the muscles better. You will have to gain more muscle at some point to increase strength. What are your strength goals anyways?

As far as your friend he just needs to keep the reps low and the weight heavy.

[sana]

sounds like your goals are different. if you're looking for strength, you should be looking into powerlifting types of training. where as your friend should be looking at a more "standards" bodybuilding workout.

either way - you need to find out how your body responds.

[beefcake]

You're probably going to want to do quicker, more explosive reps where he'll want to do slower and more controlled reps for more anabolism. Gotta remember though, more lean mass equals more strength.

[Taylor]

i work my biceps every other day, but i work them differently, whether it be close grip or wide grip barbell curls, dumbbell curls, reverse grip chinups...i'd actually say maybe 3 times in a 7 day weekis how often i work them, because i generally take one or two days of rest, which i usually just fill up with sports activity, like pick up basketball for example....

i never train till failure though. I generally do 3 sets of 12

Nutrition and what you eat i would imagine would be a large factor in whether you will gain size or strength....

i always thought that, training very heavy, with low reps is what helped gain strength....

[beefcake]

Originally posted by Taylor
i work my biceps every other day, but i work them differently, whether it be close grip or wide grip barbell curls, dumbbell curls, reverse grip chinups...i'd actually say maybe 3 times in a 7 day weekis how often i work them, because i generally take one or two days of rest, which i usually just fill up with sports activity, like pick up basketball for example....

i never train till failure though. I generally do 3 sets of 12

Nutrition and what you eat i would imagine would be a large factor in whether you will gain size or strength....

i always thought that, training very heavy, with low reps is what helped gain strength....

It does, but you also got to remember that training heavy also adds muscle. It's always about training heavy. You aren't gonna grow doing 20 reps with a 40lb db. You need to force your muscle to grow by stimulating different fibers. You're working your arms way too much. You may get endurance from your routine, but by working your arms eod, you are constantly breaking down you muscle fibers again and not allowing them anytime to heal.

[Taylor]

i was always tought you only need 24 hours of recovery time if your not working till failure....I've been training the same way for 3 years, and its suited me pretty well so far...

[Taylor]

btw...I don't train extremely heavy till failure...i'm not trying to get huge, I am training for strength, endurance, and i'm training as a baseball player not as a pro body builder

[Taylor]

my schedule is like this on a 7 day week

a day - legs, all lower body
b day - arms, upper body, abs, back
a day
b day
rest
a day
b day

that's usually how i do it, and occasionally i'll have two rest days based on my baseball schedle...I generally have two games every saturday for right now