strength vs. size

[Aurora]

The only way you can build explosive...[pay attention to the word explosive] strength and NOT muscle, and by muscle I mean size, is by doing plyometrics. If you use weight resistance you will grow. Period. If you want to lift heavy objects, and train exclusively to lift heavy objects then you will grow. (show me a small powerlifter!). You cant avoid it.

On the other hand if you only want mass, then you wont get very far if you dont lift heavy enough.

Your hooped. You have to lift heavy to grow and you have to grow to lift heavy.

[house1]

btw...I don't train extremely heavy till failure...i'm not trying to get huge, I am training for strength,

this makes no sense to me--

with heavy weights comes strength -- how do you expect to get stronger otherwise???

[Taylor]

by "heavy" i mean i dont lift 95%-100% of my max everyday, I'm by no means lifting 10lbs day in and day out, lol

[decadecadeca]

1- You said you've trained the same way for 3 years. That's a problem in itself.

2-You said you believe you only need 24 hours to recover, and yet you also said you fill your "off" days with sports/physical activity. So how do you define "off"?

3-I think you and your friend are both correct to some degree. But ultimately size and strength are directly proportional. Powerlifters are very strong, bodybuilders are also very strong. The biggest difference is the means to the end, the routine and regiment that sculpts as well as strengthens.

[plar135]

thanks for all the great info guys, so it seems like i should be going high wt low rep to gain strength and size, making it the best bet for both of our goals?

how about frequency? i was thinking this basic routine M - push (tri chest shoulder) W - pull (bi's back) F - legs...but should i go more since i'll probably be doing less sets per bodypart (say 2 working sets of 2 exercises 6-8 to failure?) or should i go M,Tr - push, T,F - pull, W,Sat - legs Sun off

will my muscles be sufficiently rested if i go 2x a week heavy weight? or will i most likely overtrain

[Taylor]

Originally posted by decadecadeca

2-You said you believe you only need 24 hours to recover, and yet you also said you fill your "off" days with sports/physical activity. So how do you define "off"?

my off day is just simply not lifting weights, i still perform some type of cardio activity in addition to a sport activity, whether it be a while on a stationary bike, jogging/sprinting, whatever it is I happen to do....

I can't just sit around the house all day, is that what you do in between workout days? I'd go insane, I gotta be doin something

[Shibby]

Originally posted by plar135
thanks for all the great info guys, so it seems like i should be going high wt low rep to gain strength and size, making it the best bet for both of our goals?

how about frequency? i was thinking this basic routine M - push (tri chest shoulder) W - pull (bi's back) F - legs...but should i go more since i'll probably be doing less sets per bodypart (say 2 working sets of 2 exercises 6-8 to failure?) or should i go M,Tr - push, T,F - pull, W,Sat - legs Sun off

will my muscles be sufficiently rested if i go 2x a week heavy weight? or will i most likely overtrain

I wouldn't do chest, tris, and shoulders all on the same day. By the time you get to the third part you would be pretty burnt out to get maximum results.

[Taylor]

Originally posted by Shibby
I wouldn't do chest, tris, and shoulders all on the same day. By the time you get to the third part you would be pretty burnt out to get maximum results.

if you mix up the order in which you do the exercises from workout to workout would that be okay....because so many exercises tend to target each of those area's in one or atleast two of the three....I generally work everything in the upper body in one day, but I always mix up my routines, , I'll work a certain area of the upper body hard to start with, and then move on to focus on other parts, and by the next workout I will focus on another muscle group primarily before working on the body part i worked out hard the previous time

[majoradams]

I have heard of some athletes who train the way taylor describes, I personally wouldn't, but if you are a bodybuilder you want to get the most out of each muscle when you train it, so to us it seems totally ridiculous

[plar135]

Originally posted by Shibby
I wouldn't do chest, tris, and shoulders all on the same day. By the time you get to the third part you would be pretty burnt out to get maximum results.

what would u recommend then? how do u spread ur bodyparts out?

[beefcake]

Originally posted by plar135
what would u recommend then? how do u spread ur bodyparts out?

Is there any way that you can split chest and shoulders to give each a day of their own? You can put tri's in there with them, but don't work both chest and shoulders the same day. Here's a sample of my workout schedule. It's loops around. Can't say it works for everyone, but it is a different flavor from the routine you got going now, which I feel the frequency is only benefitial if you're into endurance. I train more for power so hopefully it'll help you.


Week 1
Sun| Mon| Tues| Wednesday| Thurs| Friday| Saturday
Rest| Chest| Back| Shoulders| Arms| Legs| Chest|

Week 2
Sun| Monday| Tuesd| Wedn| Thurs| Friday| Sat
Rest| Shoulders| Back| Chest| Arms| Legs| Shoulders

[plar135]

Originally posted by beefcake
Is there any way that you can split chest and shoulders to give each a day of their own? You can put tri's in there with them, but don't work both chest and shoulders the same day. Here's a sample of my workout schedule. It's loops around. Can't say it works for everyone, but it is a different flavor from the routine you got going now, which I feel the frequency is only benefitial if you're into endurance. I train more for power so hopefully it'll help you.


Week 1
Sun| Mon| Tues| Wednesday| Thurs| Friday| Saturday
Rest| Chest| Back| Shoulders| Arms| Legs| Chest|

Week 2
Sun| Monday| Tuesd| Wedn| Thurs| Friday| Sat
Rest| Shoulders| Back| Chest| Arms| Legs| Shoulders

thanks! that seems like a good routine, but how long on average does each of ur workouts take? i would think that working one part would only take 20 mins tops right? my gym is kinda far from my house now, but at college it seems like a good schedule that i mite use

[sana]

Originally posted by plar135
thanks! that seems like a good routine, but how long on average does each of ur workouts take? i would think that working one part would only take 20 mins tops right? my gym is kinda far from my house now, but at college it seems like a good schedule that i mite use

if you do a single body part split a day - your workouts should run about 45 minutes.

say 4 exercises per body part - 4 sets each - puts you at 16 sets. 1 warm up set per, 3 working sets per.

[beefcake]

Originally posted by plar135
thanks! that seems like a good routine, but how long on average does each of ur workouts take? i would think that working one part would only take 20 mins tops right? my gym is kinda far from my house now, but at college it seems like a good schedule that i mite use

Actually takes around an hour. Take chest for instance. I do 3 sets each of incline, flat, decline presses and 2 sets of incline, flat, decline flyes. That'll take about and hour. Shoulders consists of 4 sets of presses, 2 sets of upright rows, 2 sets each of lateral, bent over, and front raises. That'll be and hour as well.

[Taylor]

Originally posted by beefcake
Actually takes around an hour. Take chest for instance. I do 3 sets each of incline, flat, decline presses and 2 sets of incline, flat, decline flyes. That'll take about and hour. Shoulders consists of 4 sets of presses, 2 sets of upright rows, 2 sets each of lateral, bent over, and front raises. That'll be and hour as well.

at how many reps and what % of your max do you perform the bench exercises?